APOD: Apollo 14: A View from Antares (2011 Feb 05)

Comments and questions about the APOD on the main view screen.
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APOD: Apollo 14: A View from Antares (2011 Feb 05)

Post by APOD Robot » Sat Feb 05, 2011 5:06 am

Image Apollo 14: A View from Antares

Explanation: Forty years ago, while looking out the window of Apollo 14's Lunar Module Antares, astronaut Ed Mitchell snapped a series of photos of the lunar surface, assembled into this detailed mosaic by Apollo Lunar Surface Journal editor Eric Jones. The view looks across the Fra Mauro highlands to the northwest of the landing site after the Apollo 14 astronauts had completed their second and final walk on the Moon. Prominent in the foreground is their Modular Equipment Transporter (MET), a two-wheeled, rickshaw-like device used to carry tools and samples. Near the horizon at top center is a 1.5 meter wide boulder dubbed Turtle rock. In the shallow crater below Turtle rock is the long white handle of a sampling instrument, thrown there javelin-style by Mitchell. Mitchell's fellow moonwalker and first American in space, Alan Shepard, also used a makeshift six iron to hit two golf balls. One of Shepard's golf balls is just visible as a white spot below Mitchell's javelin.

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Re: APOD: Apollo 14: A View from Antares (2011 Feb 05)

Post by BruceBWilliams » Sat Feb 05, 2011 6:17 am

What is the disjointed object in the upper right in the area by the thruster?

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Re: APOD: Apollo 14: A View from Antares (2011 Feb 05)

Post by Chris Peterson » Sat Feb 05, 2011 6:26 am

BruceBWilliams wrote:What is the disjointed object in the upper right in the area by the thruster?
Looks like a camera to me.
Chris

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Re: APOD: Apollo 14: A View from Antares (2011 Feb 05)

Post by Giordano Bruno » Sat Feb 05, 2011 7:49 am

Where are the stars ????

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Re: APOD: Apollo 14: A View from Antares (2011 Feb 05)

Post by Ann » Sat Feb 05, 2011 7:56 am

Giordano Bruno wrote:Where are the stars ????
There is no way you can see the stars in an image like this one. The Sun is up, and it is shining down relentlessly on the lunar surface. The contrast is almost blinding, since the sunlight as seen from the Moon is not softened or scattered by an atmosphere. Believe me, if you had been able to see stars in an image like this one, then that in itself would have proved that the picture was a fake.

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Sherlock Holmes

Re: APOD: Apollo 14: A View from Antares (2011 Feb 05)

Post by Sherlock Holmes » Sat Feb 05, 2011 8:41 am

What about the tyre tracks ???

The lunar jeep seems positionned ready to go
Where does it come from ???
Did they drive it reverse gear all the way ???

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Re: APOD: Apollo 14: A View from Antares (2011 Feb 05)

Post by nstahl » Sat Feb 05, 2011 10:00 am

What about the tyre tracks ???

The lunar jeep seems positionned ready to go
Where does it come from ???
Did they drive it reverse gear all the way ???
I'd think they'd just set it there. Notice there are footprints on both sides. It did come with them, you know.

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Re: APOD: Apollo 14: A View from Antares (2011 Feb 05)

Post by Ann » Sat Feb 05, 2011 11:39 am

Sherlock Holmes wrote:What about the tyre tracks ???

The lunar jeep seems positionned ready to go
Where does it come from ???
Did they drive it reverse gear all the way ???
I've never taken much of an interest in the Moon or in the Apollo project. However, I do remember that on the later Apollo trips the astronauts brought lunar vehicles with them to the Moon, so that they could drive around on the Moon's surface. So where did the tyre tracks come from? Why, from the lunar vehicles that had come out of the Apollo landing modules, of course!

In any case, I can't believe this nonsensical idea that we haven't been to the Moon. The Moon is incredibly close to us!!! Why do you think it looks so large in the sky, compared with all the other lights up there? Is it because it is so very large in itself, compared to everything else we can see up there? Absolutely not! It is because it is the closest thing to us, with the exception of occasional meteorites, asteroids and comets passing us by.

Do you have any idea of just how close the Moon is compared with everything else in the sky? If you check out http://www.noao.edu/education/peppercorn/pcmain.html, you will learn that if the Earth was the size of a peppercorn, then Venus, the nearest of the planets, would be 7 paces away from us and Mars 14 paces. How far away would the Moon be on the same scale? Why, it would be as far away as the length of a person's thumb!

So if you want to send people anywhere in space at all, believe me, sending them to the Moon is going to be exponentially easier than sending them anywhere else. Isn't it still too hard and impossible to go to the Moon, though? Not at all! Isn't it going to be awfully expensive? Yes, you can bet your boots that it will - and unless I'm wrong, in the 1960s about one out of every five American tax dollars went straight into the Apollo program! With such massive funding, it is no wonder that the Apollo program succeeded (not that it wasn't a fantastic achievement in itself, of course).

So why didn't America continue its exploration and even colonisation of the Moon? Tell me this, people. How many tax dollars are you willing to pay to make such a colonisation possible?

Ann
Last edited by Ann on Sat Feb 05, 2011 7:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: APOD: Apollo 14: A View from Antares (2011 Feb 05)

Post by arion » Sat Feb 05, 2011 12:20 pm

What is that object that looks like a turbine, cut in the middle? Someone could say that this is Photoshop!

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Re: APOD: Apollo 14: A View from Antares (2011 Feb 05)

Post by owlice » Sat Feb 05, 2011 12:56 pm

The Apollo 14 astronauts didn't ride anywhere in that vehicle; from the link for the MET:
The MET was a two-wheeled vehicle with a tubular structure 86 inches long, 39 inches wide and 32 inches high when deployed ready to use on the lunar surface. The MET had a single handle for towing and has two legs to provide four-point stability at rest.

And the APOD text includes more info: "used to carry tools and samples."
A closed mouth gathers no foot.

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Re: APOD: Apollo 14: A View from Antares (2011 Feb 05)

Post by alphachapmtl » Sat Feb 05, 2011 1:26 pm

BruceBWilliams wrote:What is the disjointed object in the upper right in the area by the thruster?
One of the stitched images could see behind the thruster.

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Re: APOD: Apollo 14: A View from Antares (2011 Feb 05)

Post by alphachapmtl » Sat Feb 05, 2011 1:29 pm

Giordano Bruno wrote:Where are the stars ????
When I take a picture here on earth with my camera, I never ever see any star. I would need a special setup to see any, like special camera or long exposure.

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Re: APOD: Apollo 14: A View from Antares (2011 Feb 05)

Post by alphachapmtl » Sat Feb 05, 2011 1:32 pm

Sherlock Holmes wrote:What about the tyre tracks ???

The lunar jeep seems positionned ready to go
Where does it come from ???
Did they drive it reverse gear all the way ???
It's not a jeep, it's a two-wheeled hand-pulled cart, a bit like those used for grocery shopping here.

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Re: APOD: Apollo 14: A View from Antares (2011 Feb 05)

Post by NoelC » Sat Feb 05, 2011 2:41 pm

arion wrote:Someone could say that this is Photoshop!
And someone would be right. Did you read the part of the caption that said this was a mosaic, assembled from multiple photos taken out the window of the LM? Why do you think the edges of the image are so choppy? There are clear signs of stitching multiple photos together (which is by no means trivial) along with a few mistakes.

I'm ecstatic that Eric Jones did that stitching. It gives us the opportunity to look around freely at very high resolution, something that brings the experience of the astronauts to us like few other kinds of media could. Think about it... Who had 30 megapixel images in 1971??? They used a very high quality film camera back then and new millenium technology to put the images together now.

What an astounding view! I'm impressed at how easily the dust from later activity appears to have covered up the astronauts earlier tracks (e.g., some of the cart tracks). Think about it - it must have been horrendous to deal with that dust in an environment where an airtight seal meant life or death!!!!

-Noel

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Re: APOD: Apollo 14: A View from Antares (2011 Feb 05)

Post by Sherlock Holmes » Sat Feb 05, 2011 2:53 pm

alphachapmtl wrote:
Sherlock Holmes wrote:What about the tyre tracks ???

The lunar jeep seems positionned ready to go
Where does it come from ???
Did they drive it reverse gear all the way ???
It's not a jeep, it's a two-wheeled hand-pulled cart, a bit like those used for grocery shopping here.

I do not see the foot prints match with the tyre tracks of the hand pulled cart and someone pulling the cart ...

Good luck

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Re: APOD: Apollo 14: A View from Antares (2011 Feb 05)

Post by orin stepanek » Sat Feb 05, 2011 2:54 pm

I say hat's off to all the astronauts of the early lunar missions that rode in those first spacecraft to the moon. 8-) Even now 40 years later; space flight is hazardous!
Orin

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Cone Crater Conundrum

Post by neufer » Sat Feb 05, 2011 3:53 pm

http://www.imdb.com/character/ch0013045/quotes wrote:
Captain Zapp Brannigan: [musing to himself after capturing Fry, Leela and Bender]
Rock breaks scissors. But paper covers rock, and scissors cut paper!
Kiff, we have a conundrum.


[list][Kiff groans][/list]
Captain Zapp Brannigan: Search them for paper... and bring me a rock.
http://history.nasa.gov/alsj/a14/a14.clsout2.html wrote: 133:20:31 Shepard: Okay. We're about the maximum elevation now, Houston. It's leveled out a little bit. And it looks like we'll be approaching the [Cone Crater] rim here very shortly.
.............................................................
133:21:15 Mitchell: (Pause) Oops! It (the MET)'s going over. No, got it. (Long Pause) Fantastic stabilization; Al, it's going to turn over. (Pause)

133:21:50 Shepard: Okay. We better reconnoiter here. I don't see the crater yet.

133:21:57 Mitchell: I agree. Rock under my wheels. (Long Pause)

133:22:28 Shepard: See this boulder pattern and all that we're in here right now? This boulder field and all?

[Al is asking if the boulder field they are in is on the map. A significant problem is that Al thinks they are farther north than they really are and still west of the Cone rim. He may be looking at the boulder field outside the southwest rim in the area immediately north of boulder 1033.]

133:22:33 Mitchell: I thought it (meaning the boulder field) was on the south rim.

[Ed has a reasonable idea where they are and, in the area south of Cone, several of the largest boulders.]

133:22:37 Haise: And, Al and Ed, do you have the rim in sight at this time?

133:22:45 Mitchell: Oh, yeah.

133:22:46 Shepard: It's affirmative. It's down in the valley.

[They heard 'LM' instead of 'rim'.]

133:22:51 Haise: I'm sorry. You misunderstood the question. I meant the rim of Cone Crater.

133:22:58 Shepard: Oh, the rim. That is negative. We haven't found that yet. (Pause)

133:23:10 Mitchell: This big boulder right here (on the traverse map), Al, which stands out bigger than anything else (undoubtedly Saddle Rock) ought...We ought to be able to see it.

[Because he has no references to help him judge size and distance, Ed does not recognize that the large boulder on the map is in sight. Al will first call attention to the "white boulder" at 133:25:40. Later, they will go over to Saddle Rock and collect samples.]

133:23:17 Shepard: Well, I don't know what the rim is still way up here from the looks of things.

133:23:23 Haise: And, Ed and Al, we've already eaten in our 30-minute extension and we're past that now. I think we'd better proceed with the sampling and continue with the EVA.

133:23:37 Mitchell: Okay, Fredo.

133:23:40 Shepard: Okay. We'll start with a pan from here. I'll take that.

133:23:47 Mitchell: All right, I'll start sampling. (Long Pause)

[Mitchell - "Right now, as I listen to this, I feel an enormous sense of frustration, just like I did then. It was terribly, terribly frustrating; coming up over that ridge that we were going up, and thinking, finally, that was it; and it wasn't - suddenly recognizing that, really, you just don't know where the hell you are. You know you're close. You can't be very far away. You know you got to quit and go back. It was probably one of the most frustrating periods I've ever experienced. There's no feeling of being lost. I mean, the LM is there; we can get back to the LM. It's not reaching and looking down into that bloody crater. It's terribly frustrating."]

[Jones - "Still, twenty years later."]

[Mitchell - "Still, twenty years later. Well, I'm tapping back into those same feelings. The only thing that really makes it palatable is that six weeks later, after the flight, when we realized that we really were there and, from point C1, another ten or twenty feet it would have been obvious. That really is distressing."]

[Shepard, from the 1971 Technical Debrief - "If we'd gotten to the point where we'd been willing to do away with the rest of the traverse (that is, do their work at the Cone rim and then proceed directly back to the LM without stopping), we could have made the rim all right. But I personally wasn't willing to do that. I felt that gathering more samples was the better of the two choices. We looked at the map again today and described two boulder fields that indicate that we were probably within 150 to 300 feet - depending on these two boulder fields - of the rim and still were not able to see it. That was a pretty good-sized lunar feature, to be that close to the top of the thing and not see it. That is just part of the navigation problem.]

[Mitchell, from the 1971 Technical Debrief - "At this point, in spite of personal frustration - and I know Al felt frustrated in the same way - to have us stop at that point and turn around and come back was the proper decision."]

133:24:26 Shepard: Okay, Houston. We are in the middle of a fairly large boulder field. It covers perhaps as much as a square mile. And, as the pan will show, I don't believe we have quite reached the rim yet. However, we can't be too far away and I think certainly we'll find that these samples (come from) pretty far down in Cone Crater.

[By collecting samples from the large rocks near the rim, they are certain of giving the geologists back home a look at material dug out by the impact from the deepest part of the crater. One use of the samples is to estimate the age of Cone Crater. Rock that had been buried deep within Cone Ridge were not exposed to cosmic rays until dug out by the impact and it is possible to use geochemistry techniques to estimate how long the rocks have been exposed. In 1975, C.J. Morgan was able to determine that Cone is about 26 million years old. In turn, good ages for a number of lunar craters permit improved estimates of the ages of other craters for which the only available indication of age is the number of smaller craters per unit area on the ejecta blanket.]>>
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Re: APOD: Apollo 14: A View from Antares (2011 Feb 05)

Post by owlice » Sat Feb 05, 2011 4:06 pm

neufer, that was very interesting! Thanks!


ETA: Dragging this over from another thread for the subheading on the lead article:
A closed mouth gathers no foot.

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Re: APOD: Apollo 14: A View from Antares (2011 Feb 05)

Post by ksgtarheel » Sat Feb 05, 2011 4:57 pm

Zoomed in at the top/center, just above the horizon line, there is a fuzzy red dot (more like 1 and a half of them) ...just wanted to see if that was mars or not...thx in advance

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Re: APOD: Apollo 14: A View from Antares (2011 Feb 05)

Post by ZenGrouch » Sat Feb 05, 2011 8:47 pm

What are the objects near the horizon about 2 cross-hairs from the left? One appears to be covered in a gold colored foil...

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Re: APOD: Apollo 14: A View from Antares (2011 Feb 05)

Post by owlice » Sat Feb 05, 2011 8:55 pm

ksgtarheel wrote:Zoomed in at the top/center, just above the horizon line, there is a fuzzy red dot (more like 1 and a half of them) ...just wanted to see if that was mars or not...thx in advance
There are two red dots on the horizon. You know what they are, don't you?

Eyes!! :shock:
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Re: APOD: Apollo 14: A View from Antares (2011 Feb 05)

Post by neufer » Sat Feb 05, 2011 9:06 pm

owlice wrote:
ksgtarheel wrote:
Zoomed in at the top/center, just above the horizon line, there is a fuzzy red dot (more like 1 and a half of them) ...just wanted to see if that was mars or not...thx in advance
There are two red dots on the horizon. You know what they are, don't you?

Eyes!! :shock:
Deja vue all over again! http://asterisk.apod.com/vie ... 25#p142316
ZenGrouch wrote:
What are the objects near the horizon about 2 cross-hairs from the left? One appears to be covered in a gold colored foil...
NoelC wrote:
Did you read the part of the caption that said this was a mosaic, assembled from multiple photos taken out the window of the LM? Why do you think the edges of the image are so choppy? There are clear signs of stitching multiple photos together (which is by no means trivial) along with a few mistakes.

I'm ecstatic that Eric Jones did that stitching. It gives us the opportunity to look around freely at very high resolution, something that brings the experience of the astronauts to us like few other kinds of media could. Think about it... Who had 30 megapixel images in 1971??? They used a very high quality film camera back then and new millenium technology to put the images together now.
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Re: APOD: Apollo 14: A View from Antares (2011 Feb 05)

Post by owlice » Sat Feb 05, 2011 9:16 pm

neufer wrote:
owlice wrote:
ksgtarheel wrote:
Zoomed in at the top/center, just above the horizon line, there is a fuzzy red dot (more like 1 and a half of them) ...just wanted to see if that was mars or not...thx in advance
There are two red dots on the horizon. You know what they are, don't you?

Eyes!! :shock:
Deja vue all over again! http://asterisk.apod.com/vie ... 25#p142316
I know! We're being watched!!

(Way on the right margin, there is another pair of eyes, about 1/5 of the way down from the top. They are everywhere!)
A closed mouth gathers no foot.

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Re: APOD: Apollo 14: A View from Antares (2011 Feb 05)

Post by neufer » Sat Feb 05, 2011 9:41 pm

[img3="Rock of Ages: Tammy Faye BAKKER ("true color")"]http://www.elmers.com/images/projects/l ... weight.jpg[/img3]
owlice wrote:
We're being watched!! (Way on the right margin, there is another pair of eyes, about 1/5 of the way down from the top. They are everywhere!)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Europa_%28mythology%29 wrote:
<<In Greek mythology Europa (Greek Ευρώπη) was a Phoenician woman of high lineage, from whom the name of the continent Europe has ultimately been taken. The story of her abduction by Zeus in the form of a white bull was a Cretan story; as Kerényi points out "most of the love-stories concerning Zeus originated from more ancient tales describing his marriages with goddesses. This can especially be said of the story of Europa". Europa's earliest literary reference is in the Iliad, which is commonly dated to the 8th century BC. Another early reference to her is in a fragment of the Hesiodic Catalogue of Women, discovered at Oxyrhyncus.

The etymology of her Greek name (ευρυ- "wide" or "broad" + οπ– "eye(s)" or "face") suggests that Europa as a goddess represented the lunar cow, at least on some symbolic level. Metaphorically, at a later date her name could be construed as the intelligent or open-minded, analogous to glaukopis (γλαυκώπις) attributed to Athena. However, Ernest Klein suggests a possible Semitic origin in AKKadian eREBu "to go down, set" (in reference to the sun) which would parallel occident.>>
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talos wrote:
<<In the Cretan tales incorporated into Greek mythology, Talos (Τάλως) or Talon (Τάλων) was a giant man of bronze who protected Europa in Crete from pirates and invaders by circling the island's shores three times daily while guarding it. Talos is said to be created from a petition from Zeus to Hephaestus, to protect Europa from persons who would want to kidnap her. According to Brian Sparkes "The most detailed treatment in literature is to be found in the Argonautica... however, we have detailed images of the episode, 150 years earlier, dated to around 400 BC."

In the Cretan dialect, talôs was the equivalent of the Greek hêlios, the sun: the lexicon of Hesychius of Alexandria notes simply "Talos is the sun". In Crete Zeus was worshipped as Zeus Tallaios, "Solar Zeus", absorbing the earlier god as an epithet in the familiar sequence. The god was identified with the Tallaia, a spur of the Ida range in Crete. On the coin from Phaistos he is winged; in Greek vase-paintings and Etruscan bronze mirrors he is not. The ideas of Talos vary widely, with one consistent detail: in Greek imagery outside Crete, Talos is always being vanquished: he seems to have been an enigmatic figure to the Greeks themselves.

Talos is described by Greeks as either a gift from Hephaestus to Minos, forged with the aid of the Cyclopes in the form of a bull or a gift from Zeus to Europa. Or he may have been the son of Kres, the personification of Crete; In Argonautica Talos threw rocks at any approaching ship to protect his island. In the Byzantine encyclopia The Suda, Talos is said, when the Sardinians did not wish to release him to Minos, to have heated himself red-hot by jumping into a fire and to have clasped them in his embrace. Students of Erich von Daniken and other "ancient astronaut theorists" speculate that Talos may in fact have been a kind of extra-terrestrial weapon or flying machine.

Talos had one vein, which went from his neck to his ankle, bound shut by only one bronze nail. The Argo, transporting Jason and the Argonauts, approached Crete after obtaining the Golden Fleece. As guardian of the island, Talos kept the Argo at bay by hurling great boulders at it. According to the pseudo-Apollodorus' Bibliotheke, Talos was slain either when Medea the sorceress drove him mad with drugs, or deceived him into believing that she would make him immortal by removing the nail. In Argonautica, Medea hypnotized him from the Argo, driving him mad with the keres she raised, so that he dislodged the nail, and "the ichor ran out of him like molten lead", exsanguinating and killing him. Peter Green, translator of Argonautica, notes that the story is somewhat reminiscent of the story regarding the heel of Achilles.

In Argonautica, Apollonius notes that the ichor ran out like melted lead. A.B. Cook first suggested that the single vein closed by a nail or plug referred to the lost-wax method of casting; Robert Graves (whose interpretation of Greek mythology is controversial among many scholars) suggests that this myth is based on a misinterpretation of an image of Athena demonstrating the process of lost-wax casting of steel, which Daedalus would have brought to Sardinia.>>
Last edited by neufer on Sun Feb 06, 2011 12:04 am, edited 5 times in total.
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Re: APOD: Apollo 14: A View from Antares (2011 Feb 05)

Post by NoelC » Sat Feb 05, 2011 9:55 pm

ZenGrouch wrote:What are the objects near the horizon about 2 cross-hairs from the left? One appears to be covered in a gold colored foil...
That's a fair question.

I assume it is some kind of science station they set up to leave on the moon, and they didn't want it contaminated or disturbed by the lift off when they left. I'd love to know the specifics.

-Noel

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