The Mystery of the Fading Star (2010 Jan 08)

Post a reply


This question is a means of preventing automated form submissions by spambots.
Smilies
:D :) :ssmile: :( :o :shock: :? 8-) :lol2: :x :P :oops: :cry: :evil: :roll: :wink: :!: :?: :idea: :arrow: :| :mrgreen:
View more smilies

BBCode is ON
[img] is ON
[url] is ON
Smilies are ON

Topic review
   

Expand view Topic review: The Mystery of the Fading Star (2010 Jan 08)

Re: The Mystery of the Fading Star (2010 Jan 08)

by orin stepanek » Sat Jan 09, 2010 1:40 pm

oops! B and F :oops:
Anyway Art; thanks for the explanation.

Re: The Mystery of the Fading Star (2010 Jan 08)

by JohnD » Sat Jan 09, 2010 12:24 pm

Thank you neufer!
I looked for some results, but you have found them

But Shakespear was referring to the Book of Common Prayer, “Earth to earth, ashes to ashes, dust to dust; in sure and certain hope of the Resurrection into eternal life”. Sure, to use another quote, "we are stardust", but Macbeth is contemplating his own imminent death and the impermanence of life, rather than its origins

John

Re: The Mystery of the Fading Star (2010 Jan 08)

by neufer » Sat Jan 09, 2010 4:14 am

orin stepanek wrote:So the B star has a dark disk of 4 au. So how far is the B star away from the A star?
I take it that the B star orbits the A star. Is that right? Or do they orbit each other?
The B & F stars probably orbit each other
(; i.e., they orbit their mutual Center of Mass) :
orin stepanek wrote:The dusty disc material must be pretty thick in order to dim Epsilon Aurigae so much. :?:
  • . Macbeth > Act V, scene V

    MACBETH: To-morrow, and to-morrow, and to-morrow,
    ___ Creeps in this petty pace from day to day
    ___ To the last syllable of recorded time,
    ___ And all our yesterdays have lighted fools
    ___ The way to dusty death(/disc). Out, out, brief candle!
    ___ Life's but a walking shadow, a poor player
    ___ That struts and frets his hour upon the stage
    ___ And then is heard no more: it is a tale
    ___ Told by an idiot, full of sound and fury,
    ___ Signifying nothing.

Re: The Mystery of the Fading Star (2010 Jan 08)

by neufer » Sat Jan 09, 2010 4:10 am

JohnD wrote:This star and its odd behaviour was featured in a discussion of variables between Sir Patrick Moore, the Good Astronomer, and Dr.John Mason in a recent Sky at Night ("Twinkle twinkle"). Dr.Mason pointed out that at the middle of the dimming, there is a slight brightening. He interprets this as a hole in the dust disc, which might be expected around a central star. Just like Homer's donut!

Re: The Mystery of the Fading Star (2010 Jan 08)

by orin stepanek » Sat Jan 09, 2010 3:18 am

So the B star has a dark disk of 4 au. So how far is the B star away from the A star? I take it that the B star orbits the A star. Is that right? Or do they orbit each other? The dusty disc material must be pretty thick in order to dim Epsilon Aurigae so much. :?

Re: The Mystery of the Fading Star (2010 Jan 08)

by JohnD » Fri Jan 08, 2010 5:00 pm

This star and its odd behaviour was featured in a discussion of variables between Sir Patrick Moor, the Good Astronomer, and Dr.John Mason in a recent Sky at Night ("Twinkle twinkle").
Dr.Mason pointed out that at the middle of the dimming, there is a slight brightening. He interprets this as a hole in the dust disc, which might be expected around a central star.
Just like Homer's donut!

See it , if you can @ http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b0 ... e_Twinkle/
Ep.Aurigae discussion starts 14 minutes in, but the whole thing is worth watching, as usual.

John

John

Re: The Mystery of the Fading Star (2010 Jan 08)

by neufer » Fri Jan 08, 2010 4:49 pm

geckzilla wrote:So a cosmic donut is responsible for causing all this puzzlement and confusion among Earth's brightest minds.
Homer Simpson would be proud if he knew. Or maybe just really hungry.
An even newer model indicates that the not so bright
yellow S star actually has a lot more mass:

Image

Re: The Mystery of the Fading Star (2010 Jan 08)

by bystander » Fri Jan 08, 2010 4:12 pm

I don't think the speed of the disk matters. The two stars (one of which is enclosed within the disk) orbit each other every 27 years. Their orbital speeds depend upon their respective distance from the barycenter.

Re: The Mystery of the Fading Star (2010 Jan 08)

by fredpalen » Fri Jan 08, 2010 3:55 pm

How fast must this disk be moving in order to eclipse the star in only two years?

Re: The Mystery of the Fading Star (2010 Jan 08)

by geckzilla » Fri Jan 08, 2010 3:41 pm

Willlllburrrrr...

So a cosmic donut is responsible for causing all this puzzlement and confusion among Earth's brightest minds. Homer Simpson would be proud if he knew. Or maybe just really hungry.

Re: The Mystery of the Fading Star (2010 Jan 08)

by emc » Fri Jan 08, 2010 3:24 pm

neufer wrote:
So you're THAT Ed :!:
No sorry... while I enjoy identifying with a talking horse... I'm actually not that smart!

But I really liked "Carol".

Re: The Mystery of the Fading Star (2010 Jan 08)

by neufer » Fri Jan 08, 2010 3:16 pm

Re: The Mystery of the Fading Star (2010 Jan 08)

by emc » Fri Jan 08, 2010 3:02 pm

Re: The Mystery of the Fading Star (2010 Jan 08)

by neufer » Fri Jan 08, 2010 3:00 pm

emc wrote:
http://spitzer.caltech.edu/news/1036-ssc2010-01-Centuries-Old-Star-Mystery-Coming-to-a-Close wrote:
... Now, new observations from NASA's Spitzer Space Telescope -- in combination with archived ultraviolet, visible and other infrared data -- point to one of two competing theories, and a likely solution to this age-old puzzle. One theory holds that the bright star is a massive supergiant, periodically eclipsed by two tight-knit stars inside a swirling, dusty disk.

The second theory holds that the bright star is in fact a dying star with a lot less mass, periodically eclipsed by just a single star inside a disk. The Spitzer data strongly support the latter scenario.
  • ------------------------------------------------------
    . Shakespeare's _Poems_(1640) Dedication
    .
    <<...to invite your allowance, in your perusal you
    shall find them Seren, clear, and elegantly plain,
    such gentle strains as shall recreate and
    not perplex your brain, no intricate or
    CLOUDY stuff to puzzle intellect.>> - John Benson
    ------------------------------------------------------
http://spitzer.caltech.edu/images/2866-ssc2010-01a-Epsilon-Aurigae-Puzzle-Pieces-Snap-Into-Place wrote:
Image

This graph of data from multiple telescopes shows the distribution of light from a pair of stars known as Epsilon Aurigae. For centuries, astronomers had not been able to figure out the nature of this "eclipsing binary system," in which a bright naked-eye star is eclipsed by a companion object every 27 years.

Data from NASA's Spitzer Space Telescope are pointing to a solution to this age-old riddle. The Spitzer data, shown in bright yellow and orange, provide the missing puzzle pieces need to fit all the data on the star together into a neat model. The blue data show ultraviolet observations, and the light yellow/green data are from visible-light telescopes. The blue data show light from the companion object, a so-called B star, while the light yellow data show light from the main bright star, called an F star.

The orange and bright yellow data from Spitzer show light from the F star and a dusty disk that is surrounding the B-star.
Image
The new model indicates that the F star is not a supergiant as a favored theory had proposed but a dying star with a lot less mass.>>

Re: The Mystery of the Fading Star (2010 Jan 08)

by emc » Fri Jan 08, 2010 2:46 pm

... Now, new observations from NASA's Spitzer Space Telescope -- in combination with archived ultraviolet, visible and other infrared data -- point to one of two competing theories, and a likely solution to this age-old puzzle. One theory holds that the bright star is a massive supergiant, periodically eclipsed by two tight-knit stars inside a swirling, dusty disk. The second theory holds that the bright star is in fact a dying star with a lot less mass, periodically eclipsed by just a single star inside a disk. The Spitzer data strongly support the latter scenario.
http://spitzer.caltech.edu/news/1036-ss ... to-a-Close

Re: The Mystery of the Fading Star (2010 Jan 08)

by mesaxi » Fri Jan 08, 2010 2:37 pm

There seems to be a dark spot to the right of the star that reminds me of pictures of molecular clouds I've seen on APOD (http://antwrp.gsfc.nasa.gov/apod/ap090623.html). I wonder if that might have something to do with it?

Re: The Mystery of the Fading Star (2010 Jan 08)

by dharma66 » Fri Jan 08, 2010 1:17 pm

Krikkit!

Careful with that star Eugene!

Re: The Mystery of the Fading Star (2010 Jan 08)

by geckzilla » Fri Jan 08, 2010 12:02 pm

I see, so the notion that there are stars out there that are impossible to detect because of dust rings is probably incorrect. I suppose we'd figure out something is there anyway since there wouldn't be any background objects either. Like Barnard 68. But it's possible to see through it mostly.

Re: The Mystery of the Fading Star (2010 Jan 08)

by Chris Peterson » Fri Jan 08, 2010 5:41 am

geckzilla wrote:There must be an amazing amount of stuff out there that just isn't illuminated or is shadowed. I wonder how many dust disks out there are concealing their stars from us. Surely there's some behind such thick dust that even infrared doesn't make it through.
Dust doesn't block IR from the star, but becomes a transformer of short wavelength radiation from the star into IR. That is, we see the IR re-radiated. Of course, given enough dust even that will get blocked, but I expect that most dust clouds of sufficient size reveal themselves in other ways. Certainly, we seem to be discovering more and more stars with dusty rings or clouds around them, now that we are starting to explore deeply in IR.

Re: The Mystery of the Fading Star (2010 Jan 08)

by BMAONE23 » Fri Jan 08, 2010 5:40 am

It does look like there is a large unilluminated dust cloud just to the right and below the star.

Re: The Mystery of the Fading Star (2010 Jan 08)

by geckzilla » Fri Jan 08, 2010 5:11 am

There must be an amazing amount of stuff out there that just isn't illuminated or is shadowed. I wonder how many dust disks out there are concealing their stars from us. Surely there's some behind such thick dust that even infrared doesn't make it through.

Re: The Mystery of the Fading Star (2010 Jan 08)

by bystander » Fri Jan 08, 2010 5:00 am

The Mystery of the Fading Star (2010 Jan 08)

by APOD Robot » Fri Jan 08, 2010 4:55 am

Image The Mystery of the Fading Star

Explanation: Every 27 years Epsilon Aurigae fades, remaining dim for roughly two years before growing bright again. Since the 19th century, astronomers have studied the mystery star, eventually arguing that Epsilon Aur, centered in this telescopic skyview, was actually undergoing a long eclipse by a dark companion object. But the nature of the companion and even the state of bright star itself could not be pinned down by observations. Continuing to collect evidence, Citizen Sky, a team of professional and amateur astronomers, is studying the current eclipse of Epsilon Aur, reporting that it began in August 2009 and by late December had reached its deepest point. Epsilon Aur is now expected to remain dim for all of 2010, before rapidly regaining normal brightness in 2011. Meanwhile, recent infrared data from the Spitzer Space Telescope supports a model for the enigmatic system that identifies Epsilon Aur as a large but lower mass star near the end of its life, periodically eclipsed by a single star embedded in a dusty disk. The disk is estimated to have a radius of about 4 AU, or 4 times the Earth-Sun distance, and to be about 0.5 AU thick.


Top