Starship Asterisk*

by **Beyond** » Sat May 31, 2014 11:47 am

It's been Artfully designed.

by **Nitpicker** » Sat May 31, 2014 11:44 am

My, what a strange dictionary you have.

by **neufer** » Sat May 31, 2014 11:36 am

Nitpicker wrote:
Can't blame Herschel for the term "infrared" radiation (nor, I suspect, for that dreadful painting). Herschel called them "calorific rays".

(Neufer, what is "SCMP"?)

Scarlet
Crimson
Magenta
Purple

SC(a)MP, v. t. [SK(i)MP] To perform in a hasty,
neglectful, or imperfect manner; to do superficially.

Herschel did not SC(a)MP the dreadful painting.

by **Nitpicker** » Sat May 31, 2014 9:46 am

Bruce, the difference is the concept of colour temperature, versus the wavelength of peak thermal emission at different temperatures.

See:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Color_temperature
versus:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wien%27s_displacement_law

At the relatively low temperatures recorded by Herschel, the bulk of the heat was coming from infrared radiation.

by **BDanielMayfield** » Sat May 31, 2014 3:01 am

And yet, we can feel the soothing warmth of infrared light, so the Herschel Infrared Experiment is no hoax or joke. So red is warm and blue looks cool but is actually, in a way, hotter. Infrared light warms our skin, but ultraviolet light, being more energetic, can burn our skin and even cause skin cancer. Red lights preserve night vision while blue light at night can be painfully blinding.

Sorry Ann, but I prefer red.

by **BDanielMayfield** » Sat May 31, 2014 1:39 am

Nuefer, after reading the link you provided to the "Herschel Infrared Experiment" I'm somewhat puzzled, because photon for photon, blue light is more energetic than red light. Photovoltaic devices work more effectively with light on the blue side of the spectrum than red light because of this. All who read these APOD discussions should know that blue stars are much hotter than red stars. Everyone whose ever learned how to use a welder's cutting torch knows that a blue flame is hotter than a red flame. So, when I saw that experiment with thermometers meassuring different parts of the spectrum that show hotter temps on the red side my skepticism was engaged. Are you trying to pull one over on us again, or what?

by **Nitpicker** » Sat May 31, 2014 12:52 am

Can't blame Herschel for the term "infrared" radiation (nor, I suspect, for that dreadful painting). Herschel called them "calorific rays".

(Neufer, what is "SCMP"?)

by **neufer** » Fri May 30, 2014 3:44 pm

.
.

: [url=http://www.ipac.caltech.edu/outreach/Edu/Herschel/backyard.html][size=200]Herschel Infrared Experiment[/size][/url]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roy_G._Biv wrote:
<<Aristotle claimed there was a fundamental scale of seven basic colors. Originally Newton used only five colors, but later he added orange and indigo, in order to match the number of musical notes in the major scale.>>

[url=http://www.gootar.com/theory.htm]Major Chords are Primary Colors[/url]

http://herschel.cf.ac.uk/science/infrared wrote:

by **Chris Peterson** » Fri May 30, 2014 3:08 pm

Ann wrote:I don't question the fact that red is usually mentioned at the top of the list. What really surprised me is that you said (or so I thought) that red is at the left in the spectrum. The way I think of it, blue is at the left in the spectrum - reflecting the short wavelengths of blue and violet light - and red is to the right in the spectrum.

It is commonly shown both ways when parts of the spectrum outside the visible are included. When just the visible is discussed, I think it's far more common to place red on the left. That's probably related to the fact that nearly everybody learns the colors of the rainbow as a child, starting with red (even if your education was so neglected as to never learn about Roy G Biv).

How many people can smoothly recite the colors of the rainbow beginning with violet? Not many, I'd wager. And for those of us in cultures where we read from left to right, that also means we tend to envision lists as ordering left to right (if not top to bottom).

by **neufer** » Fri May 30, 2014 11:10 am

Nitpicker wrote:
As this circa 1908 graphic intimates, the non-visible spectrum must go off into other dimensions:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/c ... l_1908.png

ROY G BIV would never SCMP that way!

by **Nitpicker** » Fri May 30, 2014 6:07 am

As this circa 1908 graphic intimates, the non-visible spectrum must go off into other dimensions:

: Click to view full size image

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/c ... l_1908.png

by **geckzilla** » Fri May 30, 2014 5:17 am

I don't know which way it is presented more often. I've seen it presented both ways in many different places. Heck, if you do a search for electromagnetic spectrum and look at the pictures in the articles, it's very easy to find it represented left to right, right to left, up to down, and down to up often more than one way within the same article. In my own head I tend to think of red as being on top. I don't think there is any reason for this other than that it has always been on top in Photoshop. Obviously in a more formal setting I'd want to use more precise wording but, come on, it's Asterisk. Plus if I bug Art then I consider that an accomplishment.

by **Ann** » Fri May 30, 2014 5:06 am

Chris wrote:
We generally represent red at the top of the list (e.g. RGB) or the left in a spectrum.

I don't question the fact that red is usually mentioned at the top of the list. What really surprised me is that you said (or so I thought) that red is at the left in the spectrum. The way I think of it, blue is at the left in the spectrum - reflecting the short wavelengths of blue and violet light - and red is to the right in the spectrum.

Ann

by **neufer** » Fri May 30, 2014 1:49 am

Chris Peterson wrote:
neufer wrote:
It's etymological
Always dangerous grounds for assigning meaning or choosing words...

Ground is generally the only thing below infrastructure.

by **Chris Peterson** » Fri May 30, 2014 1:00 am

neufer wrote:It's etymological

Always dangerous grounds for assigning meaning or choosing words...

by **Beyond** » Fri May 30, 2014 12:55 am

Chris Peterson wrote:
Beyond wrote:I went to a technical school to be an electrician. We didn't bother with colors all that much, mostly just black, white and red, unless we were doing something with resistors.
The old carbon resistors, that were helpfully color coded with a variety of subtle variations on brown?

Black, white, brown, tan, gold, orange, blue yellow, green, violet, red, were some of the colors. As I remember, the body of the resistor was brown, so a different shade of brown was used when the brown value was called for. The guys in the electronics shop were way more used to them then us guys in the electrical shop.

by **neufer** » Fri May 30, 2014 12:45 am

Chris Peterson wrote:
neufer wrote:
This caused the H-alpha to get bumped UP to green:
Bumped up in frequency. Bumped down in wavelength.
Maybe we should just settle for "bumped" with no modifying preposition at all.

It's etymological:

http://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/Infrared wrote:
<<The word infrared means below red. It comes from the Latin word infra (meaning below)
and the English word red. (Infrared light has a frequency below the frequency of red light.)>>

geckzilla wrote:
Well, we read a rainbow from top to bottom.

Which is why I'm "trying to be a cloud in someone's rainbow."

by **Chris Peterson** » Fri May 30, 2014 12:37 am

Beyond wrote:I went to a technical school to be an electrician. We didn't bother with colors all that much, mostly just black, white and red, unless we were doing something with resistors.

The old carbon resistors, that were helpfully color coded with a variety of subtle variations on brown?

by **Beyond** » Fri May 30, 2014 12:33 am

Chris Peterson wrote:
Beyond wrote:I've never heard of Roy G. Biv., but I'm assuming it's a name for kids to remember RGB.
Maybe you went to school before Newton?

Red Orange Yellow Green Blue Indigo Violet

Ah, had to wait a while to remember it, you mean Sir Isaac Newton, right?
Nope, I went to school a long time after he graduated the planet. I went to a technical school to be an electrician. We didn't bother with colors all that much, mostly just black, white and red, unless we were doing something with resistors.

by **Nitpicker** » Thu May 29, 2014 11:54 pm

I learnt it this way: Richard Of York Goes Boating In Venice.

I was also taught that Newton (who was supposedly the first to arbitrarily divide the spectrum into the seven colours above, for reasons steeped in ancient mysticism) considered Blue to be closer to what we would call Cyan (or Sky Blue) today, and considered Indigo closer to what we would call (Deep) Blue today.

by **Chris Peterson** » Thu May 29, 2014 10:19 pm

Beyond wrote:I've never heard of Roy G. Biv., but I'm assuming it's a name for kids to remember RGB.

Maybe you went to school before Newton?

Red Orange Yellow Green Blue Indigo Violet

by **Beyond** » Thu May 29, 2014 10:13 pm

I've never heard of Roy G. Biv., but I'm assuming it's a name for kids to remember RGB.

by **Chris Peterson** » Thu May 29, 2014 9:40 pm

Ann wrote:
Chris wrote:
We generally represent red at the top of the list (e.g. RGB) or the left in a spectrum.
We do?

Ann

Generally. I don't know how kids in Sweden learn about spectra and rainbows, but here, most everybody knows of Roy G Biv.

by **geckzilla** » Thu May 29, 2014 7:55 pm

Well, we read a rainbow from top to bottom. Maybe that started the whole thing with red being first and blue being last.

by **Ann** » Thu May 29, 2014 7:22 pm

Chris wrote:
We generally represent red at the top of the list (e.g. RGB) or the left in a spectrum.

We do?

Ann

Starship Asterisk*

APOD: The Cone Nebula from Hubble (2014 May 28)

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