Voyager I and II

The cosmos at our fingertips.
garyclaytonpalmer
Ensign
Posts: 18
Joined: Sat Jun 06, 2009 2:54 pm

Voyager I and II

Postby garyclaytonpalmer » Sat Jun 13, 2009 12:07 pm

What has happened to the early space probes that were first sent out from earth back in the 60's or 70's that have gone out past Pluto. I cannot think of their names. One was mentioned in a Star Trek movie. Oh, yes Voyager! There was a Voyager I and II right? Where are these now and do they still send back information to NASA?

User avatar
rstevenson
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
Posts: 2440
Joined: Fri Mar 28, 2008 1:24 pm
Location: Dartmouth, NS, Canada

Re: Voyager I and II

Postby rstevenson » Sat Jun 13, 2009 12:47 pm

Let me Google up the answer for you. ... ...

Okay, have a look at Wikipedia, searching for Voyager, scrolling down to the Current Status section and you will find what you seek.

Rob

User avatar
bystander
Apathetic Retiree
Posts: 16309
Joined: Mon Aug 28, 2006 2:06 pm
Location: Oklahoma

Re: Voyager I and II

Postby bystander » Sat Jun 13, 2009 1:28 pm


garyclaytonpalmer
Ensign
Posts: 18
Joined: Sat Jun 06, 2009 2:54 pm

Re: Voyager I and II

Postby garyclaytonpalmer » Sat Jun 13, 2009 1:30 pm

Message in a Bottle
Each Voyager has mounted to one of the sides of the bus a 12-inch gold-plated copper disk. The disk has recorded on it sounds and images of Earth designed to portray the diversity of life and culture on the planet. Each disk is encased in a protective aluminum jacket along with a cartridge and a needle. Instructions explaining from where the spacecraft originated and how to play the disk are engraved onto the jacket. Electroplated onto a 2 cm area on the cover is also an ultra-pure source of uranium-238 (with a radioactivity of about 0.26 nanocuries and a half-life of 4.51 billion years), allowing the determination of the elapsed time since launch by measuring the amount of daughter elements to remaining U238. The 115 images on the disk were encoded in analog form. The sound selections (including greetings in 55 languages, 35 sounds, natural and man-made, and portions of 27 musical pieces) are designed for playback at 1000 rpm. The Voyagers were not the first spacecraft designed with such messages to the future. Pioneers 10 and 11, LAGEOS, and the Apollo landers also included plaques with a similar intent, though not quite so ambitious.

It states above that there are instructions of how to play the disk. If we encountered a message from a distant civilisation how would we ever desypher what it said ? How will a intelligent being do the same from out unknown language?

User avatar
neufer
Vacationer at Tralfamadore
Posts: 14417
Joined: Mon Jan 21, 2008 1:57 pm
Location: Alexandria, Virginia

Re: Voyager I and II

Postby neufer » Sat Jun 13, 2009 3:51 pm

ttp://www.bartleby.com/142/289.html wrote:
Walt Whitman _Leaves of Grass_ 1900.
___ The Untold Want

THE untold want, by life and land ne’er granted,
Now, Voyager, sail thou forth, to seek and find.
----------------------------------------------
____ Now, Voyager (1942)

Charlotte Vale (Bette Davis):
Oh Jerry, don't let's ask for the moon. We have the stars.
----------------------------------------------
Art Neuendorffer

makc
Commodore
Posts: 2019
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 5:25 pm

Re: Voyager I and II

Postby makc » Sun Jun 14, 2009 11:55 am


JuanAustin
Ensign
Posts: 62
Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2005 3:11 pm

Re: Voyager I and II

Postby JuanAustin » Sun Jun 14, 2009 12:48 pm

Did anyone think to include instructions on how to build a cd/dvd player using metal, plastics, glass, and etc infrastructure using power generated from water, nuclear, wind or other power infrastructure and regulating agencies there of??
JuanAustin

garyclaytonpalmer
Ensign
Posts: 18
Joined: Sat Jun 06, 2009 2:54 pm

Re: Voyager I and II

Postby garyclaytonpalmer » Tue Jun 16, 2009 2:33 am

Thats what I am talking about. Its like we find a spaceship floating towards our solar system. On it is a message that plainly says in 400 alien languages from Planet X, "aksmu anshyan mdjusty ammaunnhs annsaa s asnnahs ahsb absba a sbhhfif " now who is decyphering it and figuring out what it says? Look how long its taken to decypher Egyptian and other ancient Earth cultures and learn what they were saying. Now think about it with a culture from another solar system thousands to millions of light years away.
Ever see the Outer Limits or Twilight Zone show about the alien who lands on Earth and shares a book about his planet, Millions of people believe he is of good intention and go to his planet, soon after nearly all of Earths residents have gone a scientist says "We have decyphered the book, its called "To Serve Man" but its a cookbook!" lol....
Or the Star Trek movie where the thing comes to Earth and hovers in space sending a message, only its talking to Whales not humans. And we barely know anything about whale songs...

User avatar
rstevenson
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
Posts: 2440
Joined: Fri Mar 28, 2008 1:24 pm
Location: Dartmouth, NS, Canada

Re: Voyager I and II

Postby rstevenson » Tue Jun 16, 2009 11:56 am

You seem to be insisting that these hypothetical intelligent beings wouldn't act intelligently by offering us some clues -- as we did on the Voyager plaques.

Rob

garyclaytonpalmer
Ensign
Posts: 18
Joined: Sat Jun 06, 2009 2:54 pm

Re: Voyager I and II

Postby garyclaytonpalmer » Tue Jun 16, 2009 2:44 pm

I just dont think no matter how intelligent they are in their own culture that our writting would be anymore decypherable than theirs would be to us.

The Code
2+2=5
Posts: 913
Joined: Sat Mar 07, 2009 6:39 pm
AKA: Swainy
Location: The Earth, The Milky Way, Great Britain

Re: Voyager I and II

Postby The Code » Tue Jun 16, 2009 2:51 pm

When they find Voyager 1 and 2,,, They will know us better than we know ourselves. Radio
Always trying to find the answers

garyclaytonpalmer
Ensign
Posts: 18
Joined: Sat Jun 06, 2009 2:54 pm

Re: Voyager I and II

Postby garyclaytonpalmer » Tue Jun 16, 2009 3:12 pm

Ever hear the story about how man defined God?
On day after all the knowledge of man was written down, man said is the a God. They looked and looked thru out all the books and said, not enough information. Then centuries passed and man again asked the question is there a God, Still after all that was written down was looked at, not enough information was discovered.
So man as he traveled around the world and recorded every known thing, he came to the same question again, is there a God. Still not enough information!
Finally man moved into space exploration and began studing the universe. Soon all the information was put into the supercomputers, the question was asked is there a God. The computer replied, "I Am"

User avatar
neufer
Vacationer at Tralfamadore
Posts: 14417
Joined: Mon Jan 21, 2008 1:57 pm
Location: Alexandria, Virginia

Re: Voyager I and II

Postby neufer » Tue Jun 16, 2009 3:18 pm

garyclaytonpalmer wrote:I just dont think no matter how intelligent they are in their own culture that
our writting [sic] would be anymore decypherable than theirs would be to us.

The irony would be if their message to us was on a gold plated 8-track cartridge. :roll:
Art Neuendorffer

User avatar
rstevenson
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
Posts: 2440
Joined: Fri Mar 28, 2008 1:24 pm
Location: Dartmouth, NS, Canada

Re: Voyager I and II

Postby rstevenson » Tue Jun 16, 2009 9:20 pm

garyclaytonpalmer wrote:Ever hear the story about how man defined God? ...


You're thinking of "The Nine Billion Names of God" by Arthur C. Clarke. He told it better. :wink:

Rob

User avatar
Qev
Ontological Cartographer
Posts: 575
Joined: Wed Mar 08, 2006 8:20 pm

Re: Voyager I and II

Postby Qev » Wed Jun 17, 2009 5:05 am

Sounds more like Asimov's "The Last Question" to me. :)
Don't just stand there, get that other dog!

makc
Commodore
Posts: 2019
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 5:25 pm

Re: Voyager I and II

Postby makc » Wed Jun 17, 2009 8:29 am

a time machine would solve it :) while travelling back in time, the outside world would, just like a movie on fast-backward, go from chaos to order by the same laws that it normally goes from order to chaos... so, just go back in time, maybe kill your-other-self, and harvest an energy again.

or maybe not, maybe by travelling backwards in time we would propagate changes into outside world too, and those would change the past before we can get there... ah well, this is going off-topic.

User avatar
rstevenson
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?
Posts: 2440
Joined: Fri Mar 28, 2008 1:24 pm
Location: Dartmouth, NS, Canada

Re: Voyager I and II

Postby rstevenson » Wed Jun 17, 2009 6:57 pm

Qev wrote:Sounds more like Asimov's "The Last Question" to me. :)


You're right. I must plead sagging memory (among other things) since I read the story about 50 years ago, around the same time I read Clarke's.

Rob

User avatar
emc
Equine Locutionist
Posts: 1235
Joined: Tue Jul 17, 2007 12:15 pm
Location: Canton, GA, USA

Voyager Reflection

Postby emc » Fri Feb 12, 2010 8:39 pm

Voyager in the news...

Image

"a pale blue dot"

Voyager 1 is now nearly 17 billion kilometers away from the Sun...

User avatar
jacklap
Ensign
Posts: 21
Joined: Thu Feb 04, 2010 1:33 am
Location: Grand Rapids, Michigan

Re: Voyager Reflection

Postby jacklap » Fri Feb 19, 2010 3:10 am

Voyager 1 was launched 9/5/1977 and has just passed it's twentieth anniversary as an extra-solar traveler. According to wiki it's exiting our neighborhood at about 17km/sec. It's an easy matter to calculate the age of Voyager I in seconds, minutes, days, months, etc knowing the moment of launch (birth if you have it) until this anniversary last Februray 12. But would a hypothetical "time and date keeper" aboard Voyager who had a clock that was synchronized with it's terrestrial counterpart at launch be celebrating at the same moment we did? Of course, I'm thinking of Einstein's General Theory of Relativity (?) and thinking that the timekeeper aboard Voyager would check calendar and clock and wonder why the fuss back on Earth. They're too early! Any idea of how different the two clocks might now be?

User avatar
Chris Peterson
Abominable Snowman
Posts: 13273
Joined: Wed Jan 31, 2007 11:13 pm
Location: Guffey, Colorado, USA

Re: Voyager Reflection

Postby Chris Peterson » Fri Feb 19, 2010 4:54 am

jacklap wrote:Voyager 1 was launched 9/5/1977 and has just passed it's twentieth anniversary as an extra-solar traveler. According to wiki it's exiting our neighborhood at about 17km/sec. It's an easy matter to calculate the age of Voyager I in seconds, minutes, days, months, etc knowing the moment of launch (birth if you have it) until this anniversary last Februray 12. But would a hypothetical "time and date keeper" aboard Voyager who had a clock that was synchronized with it's terrestrial counterpart at launch be celebrating at the same moment we did? Of course, I'm thinking of Einstein's General Theory of Relativity (?) and thinking that the timekeeper aboard Voyager would check calendar and clock and wonder why the fuss back on Earth. They're too early! Any idea of how different the two clocks might now be?

By my calculation, assuming that Voyager 1 was traveling at 17 km/s the entire 32 years (which it wasn't, but close enough for our purposes, I think), its clock is now behind ours by about 1.6 seconds.
Chris

*****************************************
Chris L Peterson
Cloudbait Observatory
http://www.cloudbait.com

User avatar
jacklap
Ensign
Posts: 21
Joined: Thu Feb 04, 2010 1:33 am
Location: Grand Rapids, Michigan

Re: Voyager Reflection

Postby jacklap » Fri Feb 19, 2010 4:51 pm

Thanks Chris. Somehow, I thought it might be a bit more, maybe as much as 10 minutes, going on gut feelings. Probably stemming from the little I know about having to tweak the clocks on the GP satellites almost daily(?). Might I extend my original question by further asking about the effect on Voyager 1's clock that it's tour of the gas giants had on it. These planets have many times the mass of Earth, thus their warping of space-time would be greater. Since the Voyagers had close encounters with them not only for exploration, but their gravitational boost to the next objective, would the effect have been to slow the Voyager clock a little more, or speed it up or neither relative to the clock on Earth. Thanks.

User avatar
Chris Peterson
Abominable Snowman
Posts: 13273
Joined: Wed Jan 31, 2007 11:13 pm
Location: Guffey, Colorado, USA

Re: Voyager Reflection

Postby Chris Peterson » Fri Feb 19, 2010 6:03 pm

jacklap wrote:Might I extend my original question by further asking about the effect on Voyager 1's clock that it's tour of the gas giants had on it. These planets have many times the mass of Earth, thus their warping of space-time would be greater.

No calculations here- they are more complex, and I don't have enough information about the trajectories. However, I feel pretty confident in saying that the effect of any planetary masses on the clock is orders of magnitude less than the effect from velocity alone. While the gas giants are more massive, their effect on the curvature of space-time is still tiny. Relativistic effects from gravitational fields are not significant until you have very strong fields- near the surface of neutron stars or black holes, for instance.
Chris

*****************************************
Chris L Peterson
Cloudbait Observatory
http://www.cloudbait.com

User avatar
Orca
Science Officer
Posts: 453
Joined: Thu Jan 06, 2005 6:58 pm
Location: Portland, OR

Re: Voyager Reflection

Postby Orca » Mon Feb 22, 2010 4:48 pm

1.6 s over several decades sounds like a good guess; even though Voyager 2 is moving pretty fast by our standards it is only traveling at a very small fraction of the speed of light.

User avatar
Chris Peterson
Abominable Snowman
Posts: 13273
Joined: Wed Jan 31, 2007 11:13 pm
Location: Guffey, Colorado, USA

Re: Voyager Reflection

Postby Chris Peterson » Mon Feb 22, 2010 5:19 pm

Orca wrote:1.6 s over several decades sounds like a good guess

It wasn't a guess <g>.
Chris

*****************************************
Chris L Peterson
Cloudbait Observatory
http://www.cloudbait.com

User avatar
Orca
Science Officer
Posts: 453
Joined: Thu Jan 06, 2005 6:58 pm
Location: Portland, OR

Re: Voyager Reflection

Postby Orca » Tue Feb 23, 2010 5:42 am

Oh. Sorry. :P

I meant to say, "If I were to make a guess, it would be a few seconds tops, so your calculation sounds good to me."


Return to “The Asterisk Café: Discuss Anything Astronomy Related”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Ahrefs [Bot], CommonCrawl [Bot], DotNetDotCom.org [Bot] and 0 guests