APOD: The Antikythera Mechanism (2011 Jan 09)

Comments and questions about the APOD on the main view screen.
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Beyond
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Re: APOD: The Antikythera Mechanism (2011 Jan 09)

Post by Beyond » Mon Jan 10, 2011 3:10 pm

rstevenson wrote:
beyond wrote:WHOA!, rob, you must do some serious studying between Toroids :!:
Not really. I first clicked the Quote button on Noel's post to see the URL of the image he posted. That gave me the word Pumapunku. I Googled that and had a read of the Wikipedia page I found. I already had the general idea (I was one of those kids who would rather read three books than play one game of baseball) and the material I found through Google confirmed my first impression, that the block wasn't all that old. Combine that with my own knowledge of crafts (40 years as a professional woodworker, with side glances into metal and stone work as well as archeology) and it all seems quite normal and unremarkable.

Also, it's well known that toroids twist time, so by following a rigorous regimen of toroidal consumption, I end up with more than the usual amount of time to devote to these sorts of pursuits.

Rob
Twisted Toroids may Twist time, but it would seem the circular Toroids can make you smarter to make the best use of all that Twisted time.
Hmm... If you put a Twisted Toroid through the hole of a circular Toroid and ate it, wouldn't that make you Twistedly smart :?:
And wouldn't one definition of Twistedly smart be -- INSANITY :?:
I think i have just discovered the world's biggest problem -- DONUTS :!: :!:
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Re: APOD: The Antikythera Mechanism (2011 Jan 09)

Post by rstevenson » Mon Jan 10, 2011 5:40 pm

Ah, but don't forget...

"Keep your eye upon the donut,
And not upon the hole."

Rob

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Re: APOD: The Antikythera Mechanism (2011 Jan 09)

Post by Beyond » Mon Jan 10, 2011 6:49 pm

rstevenson wrote:Ah, but don't forget...

"Keep your eye upon the donut,
And not upon the hole."

Rob
I tried to find the hole one day, but could see nothing. So i ate the donut hopeing the hole would show up when the donut was gone. Nope, nada, zilch. No hole.
I've had frosted, glazed, bespeckled and plain, but trying to find a hole is such a pain! It's easy to find the space it should be in, but that darn hole eludes me agin and agin. But I've found a solution to my problem. I just by the holes separately by the box full. You only need to nibble around the edges a little and they plug right in. Now i can eat the w-hole thing. YUM-YUM :D
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Re: APOD: The Antikythera Mechanism (2011 Jan 09)

Post by NoelC » Mon Jan 10, 2011 10:57 pm

You started with nothing, and still have most of it left.

-Noel

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Re: APOD: The Antikythera Mechanism (2011 Jan 09)

Post by Beyond » Wed Jan 12, 2011 3:23 am

YES, It's one of those scientific miracules :!:
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Wired: Ancient Greek Computer Had Surprising Sun Tracker

Post by bystander » Sat Apr 02, 2011 1:07 am

Ancient Greek Computer Had Surprising Sun Tracker
Wired Science | Lisa Grossman | 2011 Apr 01
The world’s oldest astronomical calculator is famous for having intricate gear systems centuries ahead of their time. But new work shows the Antikythera mechanism used pure geometry, as well as flashy gears to track celestial bodies’ motion through the heavens.

The device, a 2,000-year-old assemblage of gears and wheels that matched 19th century clocks in precision and complexity, was salvaged from a shipwreck off the Greek island of Antikythera in 1901.

Called the Antikythera mechanism, the machine gracefully kept track of the day of the year, the positions of the sun and the moon, and perhaps the other planets. It also predicted eclipses and kept track of upcoming Olympic games.

Most of the mechanism’s calculations were driven by a series of 37 interlocking dials, which may have been manipulated by a hand crank. The front of the mechanism had a clock-like face that denoted the calendar date in two concentric circles, one showing the signs of the Greek zodiac, and one carrying the Egyptian months of the year.

Three hands denoting the date and the position of the sun and the moon moved through the zodiac and the months as the gears turned.

“It’s a pretty elaborate piece of machinery,” said science historian James Evans of the University of Puget Sound in a presentation at the University of Washington in Seattle on March 31. “Nobody would ever have guessed that there could be something this complex in the second century [BC].”

Earlier research showed the device also accounted for a subtle weirdness in the motion of the moon. Because the moon’s orbit around the Earth is an ellipse, not a perfect circle, the moon seems to speed up and slow down over the course of a month. In 2006, Tony Freeth of Cardiff University and colleagues showed that a clever configuration of two overlapping gears, with the top gear laid off-center from the bottom gear, could give the moon’s marker its irregular speed.

Because of the Earth’s elliptical orbit around the sun, the sun makes a similarly variable trip across the sky, speeding up and slowing down over the course of the year. But the effect is much more subtle than for the moon.

“It’d be very hard with gears to mimic an effect so small,” Evans said. Also, if there were any extra gears related to the sun’s movement in the original mechanism, none emerged from the shipwreck.

Evans and colleagues suggested a simpler way to make the sun dial appear to change speed: Stretch the zodiac. If the spaces on the front wheel of the mechanism were of different widths, Evans reasoned, then the hand representing the sun would take longer to travel through the part of the year lumped under the zodiac sign of Taurus than through Libra.

The delay would make the sun look like it was moving slower at some times of year and faster at others, even though the gears turning the hand moved at a constant speed.

To check this idea, the researchers examined X-ray images of the Antikythera mechanism, parts of which were badly corroded. In a paper last year in the Journal for the History of Astronomy (which Evans co-edits), the team analyzed 69 degrees of the circle that was preserved well enough for the zodiac names and markings to be read. Since then, the team has extended the study to 88 degrees of the circle.

They found that the two circles representing the zodiac and the Egyptian calendar were divided differently, and in just the right way to account for the sun’s irregular speed.

“It made more sense to do it this way than to try to use an elaborate wheel upon wheel sort of thing, as they did for the lunar orbit,” Evans said.

At his talk in Seattle, Evans showed off a brass and wood reconstruction of the Antikythera mechanism (shown at top) that includes the stretched zodiac, as well as wheels depicting Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter and Saturn. The planetary gears are still controversial, he said, and not all Antikythera experts agree with his zodiac model, either. But Evans is confident.

“Our reconstruction of the way the solar anomaly worked, I think you can bet your retirement savings on it — or, 5 percent of them,” he said.

The mechanism would probably not have been a practical way to keep track of the passage of time, he added. Every time he moves his model for demonstrations, the gears shift around and it takes him an hour to get it working again. Rather, he said, the machine was intended to be a source of wonder.

“It was meant to be a statement, to impress, to instruct,” he said, “rather than being a day to day practical calculating device.”
Solar Anomaly and Planetary Displays in the Antikythera Mechanism - J Evans, CC Carman, AS Thorndike
  • Journal for the History of Astronomy 41(142) (Feb 2010) (pdf)
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