APOD: Collapse in Hebes Chasma on Mars (2017 May 28)

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APOD: Collapse in Hebes Chasma on Mars (2017 May 28)

Post by APOD Robot » Sun May 28, 2017 4:08 am

Image Collapse in Hebes Chasma on Mars

Explanation: What's happened in Hebes Chasma on Mars? Hebes Chasma is a depression just north of the enormous Valles Marineris canyon. Since the depression is unconnected to other surface features, it is unclear where the internal material went. Inside Hebes Chasma is Hebes Mensa, a 5 kilometer high mesa that appears to have undergone an unusual partial collapse -- a collapse that might be providing clues. The featured image, taken by ESA's robotic Mars Express spacecraft currently orbiting Mars, shows great details of the chasm and the unusual horseshoe shaped indentation in the central mesa. Material from the mesa appears to have flowed onto the floor of the chasm, while a possible dark layer appears to have pooled like ink on a downslope landing. A recent hypothesis holds that salty rock composes some lower layers in Hebes Chasma, with the salt dissolving in melted ice flows that drained through holes into an underground aquifer.

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RocketRon

Re: APOD: Collapse in Hebes Chasma on Mars (2017 May 28)

Post by RocketRon » Sun May 28, 2017 5:43 am

Unusual - certainly a spectacular and distinctive view/feature !

Be helpful to see a before and after shot, with some indication of scale, might emphasize just how material has gone. ?
And also to see a slightly wider view, it looks like some material has flowed towards the bottom of the picture and further.

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Re: APOD: Collapse in Hebes Chasma on Mars (2017 May 28)

Post by Boomer12k » Sun May 28, 2017 6:58 am

RocketRon wrote:Unusual - certainly a spectacular and distinctive view/feature !

Be helpful to see a before and after shot, with some indication of scale, might emphasize just how material has gone. ?
And also to see a slightly wider view, it looks like some material has flowed towards the bottom of the picture and further.
Will this do? Also more info... and possible Solution...

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/ ... etail.html

My thought from the article is... it bulged, tore the chasm, the area fell, making a kind of caldera, then the floor lifted from magma bulging from beneath, but did not break the surface as a volcano, so left the inner mound. OR, it was a little harder material... As it bulges, the slides occurred... My opinion.

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Guest

Re: APOD: Collapse in Hebes Chasma on Mars (2017 May 28)

Post by Guest » Sun May 28, 2017 7:28 am

Compare this photo to one of Mount Saint Helens. No aquifer needed.

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Re: APOD: Collapse in Hebes Chasma on Mars (2017 May 28)

Post by Chris Peterson » Sun May 28, 2017 12:53 pm

Guest wrote:Compare this photo to one of Mount Saint Helens. No aquifer needed.
Well, something is needed, and we don't see volcanic activity here.
Chris

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Re: APOD: Collapse in Hebes Chasma on Mars (2017 May 28)

Post by BDanielMayfield » Sun May 28, 2017 1:27 pm

Chris Peterson wrote:
Guest wrote:Compare this photo to one of Mount Saint Helens. No aquifer needed.
Well, something is needed, and we don't see volcanic activity here.
And we know that there was plenty of water on Mars in the past, so suspecting subterranean water as a cause is reasonable. What strikes me about this image is how square or rectangular the collapse is. It looks as if a humongous ice cube once was there but then it melted or evaporated away. Probably a ridiculous suggestion, but that's just what it looks like to me.

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Steve Dutch

Re: APOD: Collapse in Hebes Chasma on Mars (2017 May 28)

Post by Steve Dutch » Sun May 28, 2017 2:05 pm

The larger views posted in Boomer12k's link show that there was a large slide off the outer wall that ran into the mesa. The elevation map shows a low strip just off the mesa, and the raised lobes show that the landslide debris came from out of the picture. If the notch was created by a landslide, the debris was buried by the later slide from the outer wall.

Or maybe the "mesa" is just a sleeping Arrakian sand worm.

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Re: APOD: Collapse in Hebes Chasma on Mars (2017 May 28)

Post by Ann » Sun May 28, 2017 3:15 pm

Boomer12k wrote:
RocketRon wrote:Unusual - certainly a spectacular and distinctive view/feature !

Be helpful to see a before and after shot, with some indication of scale, might emphasize just how material has gone. ?
And also to see a slightly wider view, it looks like some material has flowed towards the bottom of the picture and further.
Will this do? Also more info... and possible Solution...

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/ ... etail.html

My thought from the article is... it bulged, tore the chasm, the area fell, making a kind of caldera, then the floor lifted from magma bulging from beneath, but did not break the surface as a volcano, so left the inner mound. OR, it was a little harder material... As it bulges, the slides occurred... My opinion.

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Interesting, Boomer!

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Re: APOD: Collapse in Hebes Chasma on Mars (2017 May 28)

Post by Ann » Sun May 28, 2017 3:19 pm

BDanielMayfield wrote: What strikes me about this image is how square or rectangular the collapse is. It looks as if a humongous ice cube once was there but then it melted or evaporated away. Probably a ridiculous suggestion, but that's just what it looks like to me.

Bruce
My thoughts too, Bruce.

Or rather... These are my thoughts!

Ann
Last edited by Ann on Sun May 28, 2017 3:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: APOD: Collapse in Hebes Chasma on Mars (2017 May 28)

Post by Cousin Ricky » Sun May 28, 2017 3:37 pm

Is this image vertical exaggerated? Comparing this image with overhead shots, the rear wall of the collapse appears to be 18 km long. After estimating the height of the debris above the floor of the depression, given the angle of the shot, perspective foreshortening cannot account for the apparent height of the mesa. Yet there is no mention of vertical exaggeration at the image source.

cabriobob

Re: APOD: Collapse in Hebes Chasma on Mars (2017 May 28)

Post by cabriobob » Sun May 28, 2017 5:17 pm

BDanielMayfield wrote:It looks as if a humongous ice cube once was there
You may be right, Ice Cube was there

Image

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Re: APOD: Collapse in Hebes Chasma on Mars (2017 May 28)

Post by Boomer12k » Sun May 28, 2017 6:50 pm

OMG!!!!! ITS A SAND WORM!!!!!! :lol2:

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Re: APOD: Collapse in Hebes Chasma on Mars (2017 May 28)

Post by Boomer12k » Sun May 28, 2017 7:01 pm

Ummmm.... maybe it was an "excavation site".... :evil:

Nahhhhh....

The fly through video is cool, on that page I left above...

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Re: APOD: Collapse in Hebes Chasma on Mars (2017 May 28)

Post by Boomer12k » Sun May 28, 2017 7:05 pm

If you look from the OPPOSITE SIDE, the are other "cut out areas"... they have erosion and sand fills the areas. This I think is an extension of that, but being on the "leeward" side the sand filled more, and the slide came from the outer wall... my revised opinion... :wink:

Fun to try to figure out....
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Re: APOD: Collapse in Hebes Chasma on Mars (2017 May 28)

Post by Nitpicker » Mon May 29, 2017 1:07 am

It is hard to imagine that the epic magma flows from the Tharsis region, are not partially responsible (perhaps as they cooled or later cracked) for the formation of all the chasms and valleys in this region of Mars. And it certainly looks like water and wind have played a part, too. If all three played a concurrent role at some time in the past, it might explain why some of the chasms are now isolated, without requiring significant groundwater flows. Based on a topographic map of the region, it appears as though Hebes Chasma might have at one time been open to drain (at least partially) westwards into Echus Chasma. And then later an isthmus formed between them. Certainly an interesting puzzle.

My comments above are obviously highly speculative. But I also think that J.B. Adams, et al, may be too quick to dismiss the flood hypothesis in the "hypotheis holds" link of the APOD description:
http://geomorphology.sese.asu.edu/Paper ... s_geol.pdf
Hebes Chasma (Fig. 1) lacks a surface outflow channel; therefore the flood hypothesis can be eliminated, ...
It may not have lacked a surface outflow channel in ages past.