APOD: M16: Eagle Nebula Deep Field (2023 May 15)

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Expand view Topic review: APOD: M16: Eagle Nebula Deep Field (2023 May 15)

Re: APOD: M16: Eagle Nebula Deep Field (2023 May 15)

by Chris Peterson » Wed May 17, 2023 5:58 pm

VictorBorun wrote: Wed May 17, 2023 5:46 pm
Chris Peterson wrote: Wed May 17, 2023 3:47 pm
VictorBorun wrote: Wed May 17, 2023 3:37 pm

I thought to emit much energy in low energy photons you need a great mass that makes a large accretion disk with cold but large outskirts
That would make sense for a protoplanetary accretion disc. Not, I think, for one around a black hole.
Can't we scale up a protoplanetary accretion disc by scaling up the whole mass and the central object mass, one sun star to 10 suns blue giant star to 100 suns supergiant star to 1000 suns direct collapse black hole?
That doesn't sound reasonable to me. Turbulent processes don't scale linearly. I think that the accretion disc around a black hole is a much more compact structure than that around a protostar.

Re: APOD: M16: Eagle Nebula Deep Field (2023 May 15)

by VictorBorun » Wed May 17, 2023 5:46 pm

Chris Peterson wrote: Wed May 17, 2023 3:47 pm
VictorBorun wrote: Wed May 17, 2023 3:37 pm
Chris Peterson wrote: Wed May 17, 2023 1:04 pm

What I'm saying is that material that is radiating strongly in IR is cool, and accretion disks are very hot and will gave very low IR emission compared with shorter wavelengths.
I thought to emit much energy in low energy photons you need a great mass that makes a large accretion disk with cold but large outskirts
That would make sense for a protoplanetary accretion disc. Not, I think, for one around a black hole.
Can't we scale up a protoplanetary accretion disc by scaling up the whole mass and the central object mass, one sun star to 10 suns blue giant star to 100 suns supergiant star to 1000 suns direct collapse black hole?

Re: APOD: M16: Eagle Nebula Deep Field (2023 May 15)

by Chris Peterson » Wed May 17, 2023 3:47 pm

VictorBorun wrote: Wed May 17, 2023 3:37 pm
Chris Peterson wrote: Wed May 17, 2023 1:04 pm
VictorBorun wrote: Wed May 17, 2023 5:46 am

So? Do you say that an accretion disc is nothing like one-temperature thing that's entitled to have some typical thermal energy of a particle or of a radiated photon and therefore to be bright in a narrow range like the visible light range for Sun? And if this lamp is bright both as an ionising UV or X-ray and in IR tells that it's not a one-temperature thermal source?
JWST team says a galaxy with an active core is IR-bright:
NGC 7319
What I'm saying is that material that is radiating strongly in IR is cool, and accretion disks are very hot and will gave very low IR emission compared with shorter wavelengths.
I thought to emit much energy in low energy photons you need a great mass that makes a large accretion disk with cold but large outskirts
That would make sense for a protoplanetary accretion disc. Not, I think, for one around a black hole.

Re: APOD: M16: Eagle Nebula Deep Field (2023 May 15)

by VictorBorun » Wed May 17, 2023 3:37 pm

Chris Peterson wrote: Wed May 17, 2023 1:04 pm
VictorBorun wrote: Wed May 17, 2023 5:46 am
Chris Peterson wrote: Wed May 17, 2023 2:55 am

IR bright material is cold. Accretion discs are hot, and emit strongly in UV or even x-rays.
So? Do you say that an accretion disc is nothing like one-temperature thing that's entitled to have some typical thermal energy of a particle or of a radiated photon and therefore to be bright in a narrow range like the visible light range for Sun? And if this lamp is bright both as an ionising UV or X-ray and in IR tells that it's not a one-temperature thermal source?
JWST team says a galaxy with an active core is IR-bright:
NGC 7319
What I'm saying is that material that is radiating strongly in IR is cool, and accretion disks are very hot and will gave very low IR emission compared with shorter wavelengths.
I thought to emit much energy in low energy photons you need a great mass that makes a large accretion disk with cold but large outskirts

Re: APOD: M16: Eagle Nebula Deep Field (2023 May 15)

by Chris Peterson » Wed May 17, 2023 1:04 pm

VictorBorun wrote: Wed May 17, 2023 5:46 am
Chris Peterson wrote: Wed May 17, 2023 2:55 am
VictorBorun wrote: Wed May 17, 2023 12:54 am

I wonder whether it's possible for a star formation to be this IR-bright and compact or is it in fact an accretion disk of a 1000 suns massive black hole?
And if this IR-lamp is also the X-lamp illuminating, exciting and turning to comet-like columns the Pillars of Creation, from «above» ? Hidden in X-range by the Black Black Bok cloud
IR bright material is cold. Accretion discs are hot, and emit strongly in UV or even x-rays.
So? Do you say that an accretion disc is nothing like one-temperature thing that's entitled to have some typical thermal energy of a particle or of a radiated photon and therefore to be bright in a narrow range like the visible light range for Sun? And if this lamp is bright both as an ionising UV or X-ray and in IR tells that it's not a one-temperature thermal source?
JWST team says a galaxy with an active core is IR-bright:
NGC 7319
What I'm saying is that material that is radiating strongly in IR is cool, and accretion disks are very hot and will gave very low IR emission compared with shorter wavelengths.

Re: APOD: M16: Eagle Nebula Deep Field (2023 May 15)

by VictorBorun » Wed May 17, 2023 5:46 am

Chris Peterson wrote: Wed May 17, 2023 2:55 am
VictorBorun wrote: Wed May 17, 2023 12:54 am
Ann wrote: Tue May 16, 2023 6:09 am
Eagle Nebula Jac Berne SPITZER HERSCHEL Mix.png
Eagle Nebula detail annotated Gianni Lacroce.png
So the brightest star forming area, as detected by Spitzer and Herschel, is located just below the "Great Arch of the Eagle"!

So, Chris, you were right: The dark "opening" of the "arch" of the Eagle Nebula is not an opening at all, but a dust cloud. And at one end of this cloud of gas and dust, star formation is taking place.

Ann
I wonder whether it's possible for a star formation to be this IR-bright and compact or is it in fact an accretion disk of a 1000 suns massive black hole?
And if this IR-lamp is also the X-lamp illuminating, exciting and turning to comet-like columns the Pillars of Creation, from «above» ? Hidden in X-range by the Black Black Bok cloud
IR bright material is cold. Accretion discs are hot, and emit strongly in UV or even x-rays.
So? Do you say that an accretion disc is nothing like one-temperature thing that's entitled to have some typical thermal energy of a particle or of a radiated photon and therefore to be bright in a narrow range like the visible light range for Sun? And if this lamp is bright both as an ionising UV or X-ray and in IR tells that it's not a one-temperature thermal source?
JWST team says a galaxy with an active core is IR-bright:
NGC 7319
Click to view full size image 1 or image 2
Stephan's Quintet 300 webb.jpg
Stephan's Quintet 300 MIR.jpg
...

Re: APOD: M16: Eagle Nebula Deep Field (2023 May 15)

by Ann » Wed May 17, 2023 3:51 am

VictorBorun wrote: Wed May 17, 2023 12:54 am
Ann wrote: Tue May 16, 2023 6:09 am
Eagle Nebula Jac Berne SPITZER HERSCHEL Mix.png
Eagle Nebula detail annotated Gianni Lacroce.png
So the brightest star forming area, as detected by Spitzer and Herschel, is located just below the "Great Arch of the Eagle"!

So, Chris, you were right: The dark "opening" of the "arch" of the Eagle Nebula is not an opening at all, but a dust cloud. And at one end of this cloud of gas and dust, star formation is taking place.

Ann
I wonder whether it's possible for a star formation to be this IR-bright and compact or is it in fact an accretion disk of a 1000 suns massive black hole?
And if this IR-lamp is also the X-lamp illuminating, exciting and turning to comet-like columns the Pillars of Creation, from «above» ? Hidden in X-range by the Black Black Bok cloud
Black holes are absolutely not my forte, but I find it extremely likely that the most IR-bright region in the Eagle Nebula is not a black hole but a region of ongoing star formation.

Let's compare the Eagle Nebula with NGC 2264, the Christmas Tree Cluster and Cone Nebula region:

Christmas Tree Cluster annotated Popov Ivanov.png
NGC 2264 in optical light. Note the two yellowish regions.
Credit: Velimir Popov and Emil Ivanov.
Christmas Cluster in infrared annotated NASA JPL Caltech.png
NGC 2264 in infrared. Note the star formation that corresponds to
the yellowish regions in the Popov/Ivanov image.
Credit: NASA/JPL-Caltech/P.S. Teixeira

Ann

Re: APOD: M16: Eagle Nebula Deep Field (2023 May 15)

by Chris Peterson » Wed May 17, 2023 2:55 am

VictorBorun wrote: Wed May 17, 2023 12:54 am
Ann wrote: Tue May 16, 2023 6:09 am
Eagle Nebula Jac Berne SPITZER HERSCHEL Mix.png
Eagle Nebula detail annotated Gianni Lacroce.png
So the brightest star forming area, as detected by Spitzer and Herschel, is located just below the "Great Arch of the Eagle"!

So, Chris, you were right: The dark "opening" of the "arch" of the Eagle Nebula is not an opening at all, but a dust cloud. And at one end of this cloud of gas and dust, star formation is taking place.

Ann
I wonder whether it's possible for a star formation to be this IR-bright and compact or is it in fact an accretion disk of a 1000 suns massive black hole?
And if this IR-lamp is also the X-lamp illuminating, exciting and turning to comet-like columns the Pillars of Creation, from «above» ? Hidden in X-range by the Black Black Bok cloud
IR bright material is cold. Accretion discs are hot, and emit strongly in UV or even x-rays.

Re: APOD: M16: Eagle Nebula Deep Field (2023 May 15)

by VictorBorun » Wed May 17, 2023 12:54 am

Ann wrote: Tue May 16, 2023 6:09 am
Eagle Nebula Jac Berne SPITZER HERSCHEL Mix.png
Eagle Nebula detail annotated Gianni Lacroce.png
So the brightest star forming area, as detected by Spitzer and Herschel, is located just below the "Great Arch of the Eagle"!

So, Chris, you were right: The dark "opening" of the "arch" of the Eagle Nebula is not an opening at all, but a dust cloud. And at one end of this cloud of gas and dust, star formation is taking place.

Ann
I wonder whether it's possible for a star formation to be this IR-bright and compact or is it in fact an accretion disk of a 1000 suns massive black hole?
And if this IR-lamp is also the X-lamp illuminating, exciting and turning to comet-like columns the Pillars of Creation, from «above» ? Hidden in X-range by the Black Black Bok cloud

Re: APOD: M16: Eagle Nebula Deep Field (2023 May 15)

by Ann » Tue May 16, 2023 6:09 am

VictorBorun wrote: Mon May 15, 2023 8:28 pm or is it a pair of co-centric globes or what
Eagle Nebula Deep Field.jpg
...

I tried to match IR image with this APOD of visible sulfur+oxigen+hydrogen by the stars that are visible in both ranges, but not sure if the stars stood still between the snapshots
Click to view full size image 1 or image 2
I seem to remember some song that went like this:

what's that mystery Bok that I see on APOD
I never believed in insight at first glance
coz I was wrong ohhh wronggg

Thanks AVAO and Victor!

Eagle Nebula Jac Berne SPITZER HERSCHEL Mix.png
Eagle Nebula detail annotated Gianni Lacroce.png

So the brightest star forming area, as detected by Spitzer and Herschel, is located just below the "Great Arch of the Eagle"!

So, Chris, you were right: The dark "opening" of the "arch" of the Eagle Nebula is not an opening at all, but a dust cloud. And at one end of this cloud of gas and dust, star formation is taking place.

Ann

Re: APOD: M16: Eagle Nebula Deep Field (2023 May 15)

by johnnydeep » Mon May 15, 2023 8:41 pm

Ann wrote: Mon May 15, 2023 3:15 pm
Chris Peterson wrote: Mon May 15, 2023 1:36 pm
Chris Alex wrote: Mon May 15, 2023 12:44 pm The somewhat pompously so-called "Pillars of Creation" near the center are dwarfed by this giant eagle!
The "Pillars of Creation" are the eagle! Not the large structure seen in this image. They are one and the same.
_
Chris is right. Below you can see that "eagle outline" in the pictures that people took with old telescopes (like, I guess, the Hale Telescope of the Palomar Observatory):


Eagle outline in Eagle Nebula.png


So as you can see, the most iconic and tallest of the "Pillars of Creation" is not a part of the Eagle of the Eagle Nebula, because the tallest pillar isn't dark enough to have stood out in the pictures taken with the old telescopes.


Ann

That's the glorious Eagle Nebula? That's the saddest looking "eagle" I've ever seen. Surely there must be a more convincing image somewhere, but I have yet to find it. As some others above have already noted, I also thought the "Eagle" was the majestic bird poised above the "pillars", with the downward pointing head and sharp beak and wide-spread outstretched wings in a posture that suggest an imminent near landing and attack of the small group of snakes or worms that is the Pillars Of Creation!

Re: APOD: M16: Eagle Nebula Deep Field (2023 May 15)

by VictorBorun » Mon May 15, 2023 8:28 pm

or is it a pair of co-centric globes or what
Eagle Nebula Deep Field.jpg
...

I tried to match IR image with this APOD of visible sulfur+oxigen+hydrogen by the stars that are visible in both ranges, but not sure if the stars stood still between the snapshots
Click to view full size image 1 or image 2
I seem to remember some song that went like this:

what's that mystery Bok that I see on APOD
I never believed in insight at first glance
coz I was wrong ohhh wronggg

Re: APOD: M16: Eagle Nebula Deep Field (2023 May 15)

by VictorBorun » Mon May 15, 2023 8:06 pm

I wonder is the arc in fact one globe in front of the other as Orin seems to hint
Click to view full size image 1 or image 2
Eagle Nebula Deep Field cat.jpg
Eagle Nebula Deep Field.jpg
...

Re: APOD: M16: Eagle Nebula Deep Field (2023 May 15)

by AVAO » Mon May 15, 2023 7:32 pm

Chris Peterson wrote: Mon May 15, 2023 4:37 pm There are a lot of unofficial names given to nebulas and other structures in the last 20 or 30 years as technology has allowed astroimagers to see so deep.
Well. If I look at the area in the infrared, I would rather choose "the spooky eagle nebula" :evil:
Image
bigg:https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/529 ... ff50_o.jpg
jac berne (flickr)
SPITZER/HERSCHEL-Mix

Re: APOD: M16: Eagle Nebula Deep Field (2023 May 15)

by Chris Peterson » Mon May 15, 2023 4:37 pm

Rauf wrote: Mon May 15, 2023 4:01 pm
Chris Peterson wrote: Mon May 15, 2023 3:58 pm
Rauf wrote: Mon May 15, 2023 3:52 pm

So, umm, what should we call the larger nebula that engulfs the pillars of creation?
Officially, it is IC4703. Casually, the larger region is commonly called the Eagle these days. Most nebulas don't have names at all, just catalog numbers.

I didn't know that. And honestly, every single source I am reading from NASA websites to other astronomy related pages, they never mentioned that Pillars of creation are actually the real Eagle itself, they all noted that the pillars are structures INSIDE the Eagle Nebula. I am young though and I didn't know what people called it before. Thanks for clarifying!
There are a lot of unofficial names given to nebulas and other structures in the last 20 or 30 years as technology has allowed astroimagers to see so deep. But most or all of the old named objects derive from what people could see through the eyepiece... which is usually just a fuzzy gray spot. In many cases, the name only makes sense in that context; today, we see these wonderful, deep, high resolution images and the reason for the name is entirely unclear.

Re: APOD: M16: Eagle Nebula Deep Field (2023 May 15)

by orin stepanek » Mon May 15, 2023 4:32 pm

EagleDeep_Lacroce_1080.jpg
I see that the large enclosure does look like an eagle in flight; while
the enclosed photo does indeed look like an eagle; probably holding
a fish! Thanks Ann and Chris! 8-)
NINTCHDBPICT000560584900.jpg
Time for a good morning stretch! :lol2:

Re: APOD: M16: Eagle Nebula Deep Field (2023 May 15)

by Rauf » Mon May 15, 2023 4:01 pm

Chris Peterson wrote: Mon May 15, 2023 3:58 pm
Rauf wrote: Mon May 15, 2023 3:52 pm
Chris Peterson wrote: Mon May 15, 2023 2:27 pm
Not true. The Eagle Nebula was named because of the visual appearance (through an eyepiece) of the section also called "The Pillars of Creation" long ago, before any of that other larger structure was even known. Calling the larger structure the Eagle Nebula is quite recent. Only that central part is visible through a telescope (identified by Messier as #16 in his catalog) and it does indeed look like an eagle visually. The large, diffuse nebula is is within is called IC4703, and that is not a visual nebula (and most certainly not with the small telescopes Messier and other early visual astronomers had available).

So regardless of how the unofficial term "Eagle Nebula" is currently used, the actual Eagle that gives it its name is the same structure as the Pillars.
So, umm, what should we call the larger nebula that engulfs the pillars of creation?
Officially, it is IC4703. Casually, the larger region is commonly called the Eagle these days. Most nebulas don't have names at all, just catalog numbers.

I didn't know that. And honestly, every single source I am reading from NASA websites to other astronomy related pages, they never mentioned that Pillars of creation are actually the real Eagle itself, they all noted that the pillars are structures INSIDE the Eagle Nebula. I am young though and I didn't know what people called it before. Thanks for clarifying!

Re: APOD: M16: Eagle Nebula Deep Field (2023 May 15)

by Chris Peterson » Mon May 15, 2023 3:58 pm

Rauf wrote: Mon May 15, 2023 3:52 pm
Chris Peterson wrote: Mon May 15, 2023 2:27 pm
Rauf wrote: Mon May 15, 2023 2:05 pm

Quoted from space.com:
Originally taken in 1995(opens in new tab) by the Hubble Space Telescope, the Pillars of Creation is one of the most iconic astronomical images of all time. Despite their notoriety, the pillars represent only a small part of the Eagle Nebula, measuring 4 to 5 light-years across, according to NASA.

https://www.space.com/16396-eagle-nebul ... ation.html

And from BBC sky magazine:
The pillars are regions of dark dust and gas contained within the Eagle Nebula that stretch about 5 lightyears long and hide embedded newborn stars from view.

You might not realise it if you look solely at Hubble's Pillars of Creation image in isolation, but they really only make up a small portion of the Eagle Nebula region.

https://www.skyatnightmagazine.com/astr ... le-nebula/
Not true. The Eagle Nebula was named because of the visual appearance (through an eyepiece) of the section also called "The Pillars of Creation" long ago, before any of that other larger structure was even known. Calling the larger structure the Eagle Nebula is quite recent. Only that central part is visible through a telescope (identified by Messier as #16 in his catalog) and it does indeed look like an eagle visually. The large, diffuse nebula is is within is called IC4703, and that is not a visual nebula (and most certainly not with the small telescopes Messier and other early visual astronomers had available).

So regardless of how the unofficial term "Eagle Nebula" is currently used, the actual Eagle that gives it its name is the same structure as the Pillars.
So, umm, what should we call the larger nebula that engulfs the pillars of creation?
Officially, it is IC4703. Casually, the larger region is commonly called the Eagle these days. Most nebulas don't have names at all, just catalog numbers.

Re: APOD: M16: Eagle Nebula Deep Field (2023 May 15)

by Rauf » Mon May 15, 2023 3:52 pm

Chris Peterson wrote: Mon May 15, 2023 2:27 pm
Rauf wrote: Mon May 15, 2023 2:05 pm
Rauf wrote: Mon May 15, 2023 1:50 pm

I don't think that's correct.. according to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eagle_Nebula and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pillars_of_Creation, the pillars of creation are within the Eagle Nebula, and I don't think the astronomers that named this nebula Eagle had equipment strong enough to distinguish the pillars of creation.. the name became popular when HST captured that region..
If however I am wrong, please tell me how.
Quoted from space.com:
Originally taken in 1995(opens in new tab) by the Hubble Space Telescope, the Pillars of Creation is one of the most iconic astronomical images of all time. Despite their notoriety, the pillars represent only a small part of the Eagle Nebula, measuring 4 to 5 light-years across, according to NASA.

https://www.space.com/16396-eagle-nebul ... ation.html

And from BBC sky magazine:
The pillars are regions of dark dust and gas contained within the Eagle Nebula that stretch about 5 lightyears long and hide embedded newborn stars from view.

You might not realise it if you look solely at Hubble's Pillars of Creation image in isolation, but they really only make up a small portion of the Eagle Nebula region.

https://www.skyatnightmagazine.com/astr ... le-nebula/
Not true. The Eagle Nebula was named because of the visual appearance (through an eyepiece) of the section also called "The Pillars of Creation" long ago, before any of that other larger structure was even known. Calling the larger structure the Eagle Nebula is quite recent. Only that central part is visible through a telescope (identified by Messier as #16 in his catalog) and it does indeed look like an eagle visually. The large, diffuse nebula is is within is called IC4703, and that is not a visual nebula (and most certainly not with the small telescopes Messier and other early visual astronomers had available).

So regardless of how the unofficial term "Eagle Nebula" is currently used, the actual Eagle that gives it its name is the same structure as the Pillars.

So, umm, what should we call the larger nebula that engulfs the pillars of creation?

Re: APOD: M16: Eagle Nebula Deep Field (2023 May 15)

by Christian G. » Mon May 15, 2023 3:23 pm

Indeed this really does look like an eagle! From today on I can enjoy the "Pillars" in a brand new light, thank you Ann and Chris!

Re: APOD: M16: Eagle Nebula Deep Field (2023 May 15)

by Ann » Mon May 15, 2023 3:15 pm

Chris Peterson wrote: Mon May 15, 2023 1:36 pm
Chris Alex wrote: Mon May 15, 2023 12:44 pm The somewhat pompously so-called "Pillars of Creation" near the center are dwarfed by this giant eagle!
The "Pillars of Creation" are the eagle! Not the large structure seen in this image. They are one and the same.
_
Chris is right. Below you can see that "eagle outline" in the pictures that people took with old telescopes (like, I guess, the Hale Telescope of the Palomar Observatory):

Eagle outline in Eagle Nebula.png

So as you can see, the most iconic and tallest of the "Pillars of Creation" is not a part of the Eagle of the Eagle Nebula, because the tallest pillar isn't dark enough to have stood out in the pictures taken with the old telescopes.


Ann

Re: APOD: M16: Eagle Nebula Deep Field (2023 May 15)

by Chris Peterson » Mon May 15, 2023 2:27 pm

Rauf wrote: Mon May 15, 2023 2:05 pm
Rauf wrote: Mon May 15, 2023 1:50 pm
Chris Peterson wrote: Mon May 15, 2023 1:36 pm

The "Pillars of Creation" are the eagle! Not the large structure seen in this image. They are one and the same.
_
I don't think that's correct.. according to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eagle_Nebula and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pillars_of_Creation, the pillars of creation are within the Eagle Nebula, and I don't think the astronomers that named this nebula Eagle had equipment strong enough to distinguish the pillars of creation.. the name became popular when HST captured that region..
If however I am wrong, please tell me how.
Quoted from space.com:
Originally taken in 1995(opens in new tab) by the Hubble Space Telescope, the Pillars of Creation is one of the most iconic astronomical images of all time. Despite their notoriety, the pillars represent only a small part of the Eagle Nebula, measuring 4 to 5 light-years across, according to NASA.

https://www.space.com/16396-eagle-nebul ... ation.html

And from BBC sky magazine:
The pillars are regions of dark dust and gas contained within the Eagle Nebula that stretch about 5 lightyears long and hide embedded newborn stars from view.

You might not realise it if you look solely at Hubble's Pillars of Creation image in isolation, but they really only make up a small portion of the Eagle Nebula region.

https://www.skyatnightmagazine.com/astr ... le-nebula/
Not true. The Eagle Nebula was named because of the visual appearance (through an eyepiece) of the section also called "The Pillars of Creation" long ago, before any of that other larger structure was even known. Calling the larger structure the Eagle Nebula is quite recent. Only that central part is visible through a telescope (identified by Messier as #16 in his catalog) and it does indeed look like an eagle visually. The large, diffuse nebula is is within is called IC4703, and that is not a visual nebula (and most certainly not with the small telescopes Messier and other early visual astronomers had available).

So regardless of how the unofficial term "Eagle Nebula" is currently used, the actual Eagle that gives it its name is the same structure as the Pillars.

Re: APOD: M16: Eagle Nebula Deep Field (2023 May 15)

by Rauf » Mon May 15, 2023 2:05 pm

Rauf wrote: Mon May 15, 2023 1:50 pm
Chris Peterson wrote: Mon May 15, 2023 1:36 pm
Chris Alex wrote: Mon May 15, 2023 12:44 pm The somewhat pompously so-called "Pillars of Creation" near the center are dwarfed by this giant eagle!
The "Pillars of Creation" are the eagle! Not the large structure seen in this image. They are one and the same.
_
I don't think that's correct.. according to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eagle_Nebula and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pillars_of_Creation, the pillars of creation are within the Eagle Nebula, and I don't think the astronomers that named this nebula Eagle had equipment strong enough to distinguish the pillars of creation.. the name became popular when HST captured that region..
If however I am wrong, please tell me how.
Quoted from space.com:
Originally taken in 1995(opens in new tab) by the Hubble Space Telescope, the Pillars of Creation is one of the most iconic astronomical images of all time. Despite their notoriety, the pillars represent only a small part of the Eagle Nebula, measuring 4 to 5 light-years across, according to NASA.

https://www.space.com/16396-eagle-nebul ... ation.html

And from BBC sky magazine:
The pillars are regions of dark dust and gas contained within the Eagle Nebula that stretch about 5 lightyears long and hide embedded newborn stars from view.

You might not realise it if you look solely at Hubble's Pillars of Creation image in isolation, but they really only make up a small portion of the Eagle Nebula region.

https://www.skyatnightmagazine.com/astr ... le-nebula/

Re: APOD: M16: Eagle Nebula Deep Field (2023 May 15)

by Christian G. » Mon May 15, 2023 2:04 pm

I always thought the shape of an eagle spanning its wings was above the pillars with its head right over, as though the eagle was honing in on them for a kill!

Re: APOD: M16: Eagle Nebula Deep Field (2023 May 15)

by Rauf » Mon May 15, 2023 1:50 pm

Chris Peterson wrote: Mon May 15, 2023 1:36 pm
Chris Alex wrote: Mon May 15, 2023 12:44 pm The somewhat pompously so-called "Pillars of Creation" near the center are dwarfed by this giant eagle!
The "Pillars of Creation" are the eagle! Not the large structure seen in this image. They are one and the same.
_
I don't think that's correct.. according to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eagle_Nebula and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pillars_of_Creation, the pillars of creation are within the Eagle Nebula, and I don't think the astronomers that named this nebula Eagle had equipment strong enough to distinguish the pillars of creation.. the name became popular when HST captured that region..
If however I am wrong, please tell me how.

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