The Making Of Our Solar System?

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Beyond
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The Making Of Our Solar System?

Post by Beyond » Sat Jan 16, 2016 7:55 pm

Here is a 16 minute somewhat Sirius view of how our solar system was made.
Click to play embedded YouTube video.
To find the Truth, you must go Beyond.

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neufer
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Re: The Making Of Our Solar System?

Post by neufer » Sun Jan 17, 2016 9:20 am


Lufo = A person that doesn't get any joke.
----------------------------------

A: Thit's taegh!

B: Whit's taegh?

A: Lufo.

B: Whit's Lufo?

A: Lufo's i migizuno.

B: Haw mech daos ut cast?

A: I dumo.

B: U anly hivo i nuckol.

A: Thit's taegh!
Art Neuendorffer

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BMAONE23
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Re: The Making Of Our Solar System?

Post by BMAONE23 » Tue Mar 29, 2016 5:24 pm

Unfortunately, neither of which are currently very efficient and both extremely expensive without government subsidies.
Ivanpah Molten Salt reactors (BrightSource Energy) have yet to produce their touted 1,000,000 MWh per year and still need to use NG turbines to maintain the core temperature at night and avoid the Costly Start-Up time.
I ran the numbers for Solar about 4 years ago.
To install Solar PV at my house and completely offset my electric usage would cost between $60 - $80,000 which would take almost 35 years to recover in saved energy expenses for the Grid Sourced power alternative. At that rate, I would need to begin replacing Solar Panels before the system saved enough to pay for itself.
PV are far more costly to initiate and CSP projects like Ivanpah can't deliver without a conventional power back-up source

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neufer
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Re: The Making Of Our Solar System?

Post by neufer » Tue Mar 29, 2016 7:06 pm

BMAONE23 wrote:
I ran the numbers for Solar about 4 years ago.

To install Solar PV at my house and completely offset my electric usage would cost between $60 - $80,000 which would take almost 35 years to recover in saved energy expenses for the Grid Sourced power alternative. At that rate, I would need to begin replacing Solar Panels before the system saved enough to pay for itself.

PV are far more costly to initiate and CSP projects like Ivanpah can't deliver without a conventional power back-up source
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swanson's_law wrote: <<Swanson's Law is an observation that the price of solar photovoltaic modules tends to drop 20 percent for every doubling of cumulative shipped volume. At present rates, costs halve about every 10 years. The Law is named after Richard Swanson, the founder of SunPower Corporation a solar panel manufacturer. Swanson's Law has been compared to Moore's Law. Crystalline silicon photovoltaic cell prices have fallen from $76.67 per watt in 1977 to $0.36 per watt in 2014. A 2015 study shows price/kWh dropping by 10% per year since 1980, and predicts that solar could contribute 20% of total electricity consumption by 2030.

Swanson was not the first person to make this observation. The method used by Swanson is more commonly referred to as learning curve or experience curve analysis. It was first developed and applied to the aeronautics industry in the mid-1930s, and saw its first widespread application to the photovoltaics industry in the mid-1990s.>>
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BMAONE23
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Re: The Making Of Our Solar System?

Post by BMAONE23 » Tue Mar 29, 2016 7:19 pm

Well, I shall simply have to rerun my figures again. Thanks Neufer.

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BMAONE23
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Re: The Making Of Our Solar System?

Post by BMAONE23 » Tue Mar 29, 2016 7:28 pm

After looking up current pricing to produce 6KW daily for my house
60 - 100w panels and associated equipment $10,000 going with 250W panels I could knock this part down to $5,000
Structure for mounting solar panels (can't put it on my roof) $35,000 (supports, foundations)
Labor to install ??? (guess $8,000)
Battery Back-up (storage) ?? Probably best tied into the grid and backfeed during the day

Still looking at $50,000ish for my house as it can't be installed on my roof and I have very little available south facing open property.

All for something that only produces power 22% - 27% of the time

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Chris Peterson
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Re: The Making Of Our Solar System?

Post by Chris Peterson » Tue Mar 29, 2016 8:03 pm

BMAONE23 wrote:Unfortunately, neither of which are currently very efficient and both extremely expensive without government subsidies.
Ivanpah Molten Salt reactors (BrightSource Energy) have yet to produce their touted 1,000,000 MWh per year and still need to use NG turbines to maintain the core temperature at night and avoid the Costly Start-Up time.
I ran the numbers for Solar about 4 years ago.
To install Solar PV at my house and completely offset my electric usage would cost between $60 - $80,000 which would take almost 35 years to recover in saved energy expenses for the Grid Sourced power alternative. At that rate, I would need to begin replacing Solar Panels before the system saved enough to pay for itself.
PV are far more costly to initiate and CSP projects like Ivanpah can't deliver without a conventional power back-up source
Currently, small and middle scale PV solar power (home, business, community) is economically competitive with coal and gas power sources in many markets (and that's not considering that coal and gas benefit from numerous, largely hidden government subsidies). This evaluation is not considering any subsidies for solar. And the situation is continuing to shift in favor of PV power, and that's just considering current PV technology. It's all but certain that within a few years we'll see perovskite and other organic PV technologies commercialized, which will reduce the panel cost to nearly nothing.

I just recently designed and installed a PV system, and the costs involved in everything except the batteries was extremely low. Almost all the cost of a decent PV system these days is in batteries. However, there's good reason to think that some major battery technology breakthroughs are quite close. I've read a number of papers about this lately. The explosive growth of portable devices, and great investments in electric vehicles, are driving a lot of research.
Chris

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Chris Peterson
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Re: The Making Of Our Solar System?

Post by Chris Peterson » Tue Mar 29, 2016 8:14 pm

BMAONE23 wrote:After looking up current pricing to produce 6KW daily for my house
60 - 100w panels and associated equipment $10,000 going with 250W panels I could knock this part down to $5,000
Structure for mounting solar panels (can't put it on my roof) $35,000 (supports, foundations)
Labor to install ??? (guess $8,000)
Battery Back-up (storage) ?? Probably best tied into the grid and backfeed during the day

Still looking at $50,000ish for my house as it can't be installed on my roof and I have very little available south facing open property.

All for something that only produces power 22% - 27% of the time
That sounds crazy high. The system I just put together was smaller- 2KWH/day, with AGM batteries, panels on a commercial ground mount designed for 90 mph wind, high-end true sine inverter, battery system sized for three days autonomous operation (that is, three sequential sunless days). Total cost of the system was $3250. (I used four 250W Hyundai panels at $214 each.)

No installation costs because it was done with volunteer labor, but I doubt it would have been over $1000 if done by a contractor.
Chris

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