Dark matter / energy

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THX1138
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Dark matter / energy

Post by THX1138 » Fri Jul 23, 2021 5:42 pm

I just had a thought, I'm wondering if there is any correlation between the amount of dark matter / energy surrounding some galaxies and the sizes of the black holes in their centers namely could this unknown stuff be connected to the jets we've seen spewing from one back hole or another?
I've come to the conclusion that when i said i wanted to be somebody when i grew up i probably should have been more specific

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Chris Peterson
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Re: Dark matter / energy

Post by Chris Peterson » Fri Jul 23, 2021 6:05 pm

THX1138 wrote:
Fri Jul 23, 2021 5:42 pm
I just had a thought, I'm wondering if there is any correlation between the amount of dark matter / energy surrounding some galaxies and the sizes of the black holes in their centers namely could this unknown stuff be connected to the jets we've seen spewing from one back hole or another?
First of all, there's no connection between dark matter and dark energy, other than the word "dark". Dark matter is, almost certainly, matter (particles). Dark energy is a property of the Universe that either modifies gravity over long distances, or counters it.

Galaxies are surrounded by halos of dark matter. There is no reason to think this has anything to do with central black holes. Jets are well understood at a basic level, even if many questions remain. And all they are doing is ejecting ordinary matter before it can fall into the black hole.
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Re: Dark matter / energy

Post by Lariliss » Tue Oct 12, 2021 1:55 pm

Dark matter and dark energy is something that we know is there, but we don't know what it is.
I agree with Chris, thank you for short and exact answering the question.

Black holes - are the 'spheres', which have gravity, that even light can't escape. And for today's technology, we don't have any information on what is below event horizon. But according to the physics laws the information cannot be lost.

In 2012 we have answered all questions of physics of elementary particles, that can emit, decay into something and go through energy transformation. It was done by finding Higgs Boson.

Now dark matter and dark energy are in the focus. With the unprecedented science and technology advances, let's hope for new answers soon.

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Re: Dark matter / energy

Post by Chris Peterson » Tue Oct 12, 2021 2:05 pm

Lariliss wrote:
Tue Oct 12, 2021 1:55 pm
Dark matter and dark energy is something that we know is there, but we don't know what it is.
I agree with Chris, thank you for short and exact answering the question.

Black holes - are the 'spheres', which have gravity, that even light can't escape. And for today's technology, we don't have any information on what is below event horizon. But according to the physics laws the information cannot be lost.

In 2012 we have answered all questions of physics of elementary particles, that can emit, decay into something and go through energy transformation. It was done by finding Higgs Boson.

Now dark matter and dark energy are in the focus. With the unprecedented science and technology advances, let's hope for new answers soon.
Our theory does describe what goes on inside the event horizon (answer: nothing different than what goes on outside it). Where theory fails, and observation is apparently impossible, is what happens at the actual black hole itself- the (presumed) singularity at the center.
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Re: Dark matter / energy

Post by neufer » Tue Oct 12, 2021 2:48 pm

Chris Peterson wrote:
Tue Oct 12, 2021 2:05 pm
Lariliss wrote:
Tue Oct 12, 2021 1:55 pm

Black holes - are the 'spheres', which have gravity, that even light can't escape. And for today's technology, we don't have any information on what is below event horizon. But according to the physics laws the information cannot be lost.
Our theory does describe what goes on inside the event horizon (answer: nothing different than what goes on outside it). Where theory fails, and observation is apparently impossible, is what happens at the actual black hole itself- the (presumed) singularity at the center.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Event_horizon#Beyond_general_relativity wrote:
<<According to the controversial black hole firewall hypothesis, matter falling into a black hole would be burned to a crisp by a high energy "firewall" at the event horizon.

An alternative is provided by the complementarity principle, according to which, in the chart of the far observer, infalling matter is thermalized at the horizon and reemitted as Hawking radiation, while in the chart of an infalling observer matter continues undisturbed through the inner region and is destroyed at the singularity. This hypothesis does not violate the no-cloning theorem as there is a single copy of the information according to any given observer. Black hole complementarity is actually suggested by the scaling laws of strings approaching the event horizon, suggesting that in the Schwarzschild chart they stretch to cover the horizon and thermalize into a Planck length-thick membrane.>>
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Re: Dark matter / energy

Post by Lariliss » Tue Oct 12, 2021 5:14 pm

Dear Chris, you are right.
Some amendment: singularity is not exactly a physical understanding, it is rather a mathematical model, which we have to follow. My point was the 'information loss'.
And of course, the most strong alternative theories are ahead for new findings.

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Re: Dark matter / energy

Post by neufer » Wed Oct 13, 2021 10:13 pm

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firewall_(physics) wrote:
<<A black hole firewall is a hypothetical phenomenon where an observer falling into a black hole encounters high-energy quanta at (or near) the event horizon. The "firewall" phenomenon was proposed in 2012 by physicists Ahmed Almheiri, Donald Marolf, Joseph Polchinski, and James Sully as a possible solution to an apparent inconsistency in black hole complementarity. The use of a firewall to resolve this inconsistency remains controversial, with physicists divided as to the solution to the paradox.

According to quantum field theory in curved spacetime, a single emission of Hawking radiation involves two mutually entangled particles. The outgoing particle escapes and is emitted as a quantum of Hawking radiation; the infalling particle is swallowed by the black hole. Assume a black hole formed a finite time in the past and will fully evaporate away in some finite time in the future. Then, it will only emit a finite amount of information encoded within its Hawking radiation. Assume that at time t, more than half of the information had already been emitted. According to widely accepted research by physicists like Don Page and Leonard Susskind, an outgoing particle emitted at time t must be entangled with all the Hawking radiation the black hole has previously emitted. This creates a paradox: a principle called "monogamy of entanglement" requires that, like any quantum system, the outgoing particle cannot be fully entangled with two independent systems at the same time; yet here the outgoing particle appears to be entangled with both the infalling particle and, independently, with past Hawking radiation.

In order to resolve the paradox, physicists may eventually be forced to give up one of three time-tested theories: Einstein's equivalence principle, unitarity, or existing quantum field theory.

Some scientists suggest that the entanglement must somehow get immediately broken between the infalling particle and the outgoing particle. Breaking this entanglement would release large amounts of energy, thus creating a searing "black hole firewall" at the black hole event horizon. This resolution requires a violation of Einstein's equivalence principle, which states that free-falling is indistinguishable from floating in empty space. This violation has been characterized as "outrageous"; theoretical physicist Raphael Bousso has complained that "a firewall simply can't appear in empty space, any more than a brick wall can suddenly appear in an empty field :bang: and smack you in the face."

Some scientists suggest that there is in fact no entanglement between the emitted particle and previous Hawking radiation. This resolution would require black hole information loss, a controversial violation of unitarity.

Others, such as Steve Giddings, suggest modifying quantum field theory so that entanglement would be gradually lost as the outgoing and infalling particles separate, resulting in a more gradual release of energy inside the black hole, and consequently no firewall.

Juan Maldacena and Leonard Susskind have suggested in ER=EPR that the outgoing and infalling particles are somehow connected by wormholes, and therefore are not independent systems; however, as of 2013, this hypothesis is still a "work in progress".

The fuzzball picture resolves the dilemma by replacing the 'no-hair' vacuum with a stringy quantum state, thus explicitly coupling any outgoing Hawking radiation with the formation history of the black hole.

Stephen Hawking received widespread mainstream media coverage in January 2014 with an informal proposal to replace the event horizon of a black hole with an "apparent horizon" where infalling matter is suspended and then released; however, some scientists have expressed confusion about what precisely is being proposed and how the proposal would solve the paradox.

The firewall would exist at the black hole's event horizon, and would be invisible to observers outside the event horizon. Matter passing through the event horizon into the black hole would immediately be "burned to a crisp" by an arbitrarily hot "seething maelstrom of particles" at the firewall.

In a merger of two black holes, the characteristics of a firewall (if any) may leave a mark on the outgoing gravitational radiation as "echoes" when waves bounce in the vicinity of the fuzzy event horizon. The expected quantity of such echoes is theoretically unclear, as physicists don't currently have a good physical model of firewalls. In 2016, cosmologist Niayesh Afshordi and others argued there were tentative signs of some such echo in the data from the first black hole merger detected by LIGO; more recent work has argued there is no statistically significant evidence for such echoes in the data.
>>
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